Real Deal

Pissed that he didn't get the surgery earlier, but it's whatever. More playing time for Caracter at the beginning of the season. Dude is a monster.

Yeah, I read it. It also doesn't mean that the trio are worse, and because we are talking about a team sport, my argument trumps yours. My apologies. Cool, be a smartass about it. 1) James: 31.19 2) Wade: 28.10 3) Durant: 26.23 4) Bosh: 17.7 5) Duncan: 24.79 6) Howard: 24.07 7) Paul: 23.74 8) Oden: 21.9 9) Nowitzki: 23.01 10) Gasol: 22.97 11) Stoudemire: 22.69 12) Ginobili: 22.54 13) Anthony: 22.29 14) Lee: 22.28 15) Bryant: 21.95 23) Williams: 20.62 30) Garnett: 19.51 (highest Celtic) 41) Rose: 18.69 (under Arenas and Beaubois, by the way) Yeah, let's use PER stats to see how good players are. Very convincing. You mean like everyone but one other member? That's fine. LOL. We're all shaking like a chihuahua in the rain, dude. Please believe me when I say that very few Lakers fans give a [expletive] about the Heat. We're more excited to see how they play, really. Boston is still the team to beat out East, and I'm rooting for them to get back to the Finals because I can't stand the green. It'll be fun watching the Heat play, lots of scoring and athleticism, highlight plays, kind of like the 2004 Olympic team.

You just contradicted yourself. I gave you proof that the duo is better than the trio, because they created a dynasty. Your trio has yet to win a single pre-season game, a regular season game, or even a SCRIMMAGE. Your way of looking at success is combining stats. Sorry, that's not how it works. The facts are right in front of you: Kobe and Shaq are proven champions, arguably the greatest duo of all-time. Your Heat trio? Nothing, nada, zip, zilch. I'm sure you can use your logic to "prove" that McGrady, Kevin Martin and Aaron Brooks would be a better trio than Kobe and Shaq (add up the averages!), but unfortunately, it's not all black and white. There's a reason why you stand alone (or with one other fan, who likes the Heat), and everyone else, including some Heat fans and even non-Lakers fans, aren't slobbering over a trio that has done as much as me, Aaron and Justin on an NBA court together. They've got great talent. There's no question about their talent they have, but, talent doesn't always win. The team that shows the best teamwork will win it." Coming from the greatest coach of all-time. You should take notes.

You forgot the second best scorer on the team, but that would make sense for you to leave him off and include Pavlovic (who didn't even start, originally). And Allen Iverson did the same thing with all of his shooters and defensive-minded players and coach, in 2001. They basically had the same build, team-wise. A 30 PPG slasher that can get to the rim at will (LeBron, Iverson) will win 50-60 games and have an excellent team if he's surrounded by defensive players and shooters, and a defensive-minded coach. That team LeBron led to the Finals was 4th defensively, 18th offensively. Back in 2007, LeBron was not known as an elite defensive player. The fact of the matter is, Kobe and Shaq are great. Wade and LeBron are very, very good. There's a big difference between the words "great" and "good" in the game of basketball. Nine rings, from two legends of the game, two top ten of all-time (arguably top five when they both retire), mentioned in the same sentence as three guys that don't want to compete against each other while they are in their primes, that have a combined one ring, that have fans that can't even SETTLE for others saying their unproven superstar trio will make the Finals? Please. I'm sincerely done debating this nonsense.

Thanks guys.

You might be the only person on OTR that thinks Wade and LeBron are on the same level as Kobe and Shaq. That speaks volumes. I could care less what their numbers are as individual players on separate teams. Kevin Martin could average 25-30 points by himself...doesn't mean much to me. Bryant and Shaq averaged nearly 60 combined points, were the two responsible for the dynasty in Los Angeles, and they didn't need a third 20 PPG scorer to get it done. This is similar to all of those mocks we ran in the past, when my brother was ripping people off by combining his players' stats, and snagging a superstar with a borderline all-star, a sixth man and deep bench players. Jordan and Pippen, Kobe and Shaq, Magic and Kareem. Don't ever stick Wade and LeBron in that group of players, ever, until they have accomplished true greatness.

It's not April Fool's, so I seriously do not get this. Prime Kobe locks up either one today. He doesn't need double teams to do it. Shaq would toy with Chris Bosh so much, he would make Bosh look like Slaven Medvedenko in the post. I really can't believe this is a discussion. Who are the two voters that selected the trio? Just curious...

Haha, a friend of mine bought one for his apartment. It's amazing.

Don Nelson has been an excellent coach most of his coaching career, but these last few years at Golden State have been a wreck. I'm not sure what it is, really...but there's something missing, maybe the desire.

He's going to be in it. The top four "amateur dunkers" will compete in the dunk contest this upcoming season (or they will compete for one spot in it, not exactly sure)...and if this guy makes the contest (and he should), he will definitely win it.

Yeah, I actually had to think about it, as far as building around them. That was my original answer. http://www.otrbasketball.com/forums/topic/17508-prime-shaq-and-kobe-vs-the-miami-3/page__view__findpost__p__184531 But when I see someone saying that it's not even close? That the Wade and LeBron duo, alone, are on the same level as the Kobe and Shaq duo? That's feeding a different beast.

Haha, I honestly don't know what else to say. Lakers fans are usually hated because they are homers, but our "homerism" kicks in AFTER we win something. This Miami Heat trio is in the same exact boat as the Arenas, Jamison and Butler trio: no rings. And, well, no nothing. No wins. No 50-win season. Nothing. I get the feeling some fans WANT their team to be the center of attention. Not going to throw Cleveland fans under the bus too much, but they were the same way at one point. Just don't raise that bar too high. I'm sure a lot of members on OTR can cook up a mean crow.

I'm really not sure if you guys are serious with this mess, or not. I mean, to say that a Wade and LeBron duo is on the same level as Kobe and Shaq? That's already hitting rock bottom to begin with. Basketball isn't math. Garnett + Rondo + Pierce + Allen + Perkins > Kobe + Gasol + Odom + Artest + injured Drew? Was LeBron supposed to beat the Detroit Pistons? I mean, come on...Billups + Rip + Prince + Ben + Sheed > LeBron + West, right?

LOL, dude...you can quote me right now: the Heat will make the Finals. Now, let me quote you when you say the Heat will win seven consecutive rings. LeBron is in your head. For a few years, you were all over Cavs fans' asses about how they overrate him, how they overrate their team, etc. Now, you're following their footsteps.

McGrady averaged 30 PPG also. Are you trying to tell us that McGrady was more difficult to defend than O'Neal? I'm not even going to bother with this topic, if you're going to go that route. That's absolutely ridiculous.

No, we're comparing quite possibly the greatest duo of all-time, and two top ten players of all-time, to three guys that have never played a single game together. I've never in my life seen a team this overrated before, without playing a single game. Ever. Not even the 2004 Lakers, with Malone and GP.

Haha. You would need Bosh AND one of the other two just to defend Shaq in the post. Shaq won his first ring without a prime Kobe. You're telling me that Wade, Bosh and LeBron are better than a prime duo of Shaq and Bryant, the same duo that ran the 15-1 record in the playoffs? Had that duo not suffered so many injuries throughout the years they were together, they would've challenged the Bulls' record for most wins in a season, and that's WITHOUT a third scoring option. Give both groups of players teammates to work with (or just take the dynasty Lakers vs. the current Heat team), and Miami wins one or two games in a series, at the most.

Whoa, the Willie Green era in Philly is OVER. :o

Haha man, I swear, I know I'll never do it again. I have a nasty mid-range game, but I rarely pull up for threes. I hit two of them during our first game, and I got the ball kicked back out to me on a drive, and I drilled a third. Hit a fourth the next possession, walking up the court and pulling up without passing. It got wicked from there, scored ALL of the points in the second game to 21, almost all of them in the third game.

I hit 16 consecutive threes at the park tonight. Never done anything like that, ever. It was in-game, too...and I swear on my life, I was giving myself goosebumps, and I felt like there wasn't a single player on my team at one point. And I will never do that again, either. I don't think I could go back out there and even hit four or five threes in a row, unguarded.

That was actually really funny, and mean. He's good at giving himself shots, though, just not good at giving his team shots.

Legalize drugs? Maybe weed, but go ahead and legalize things like meth and coke and see how many people are killed, by accident and intentionally, at work or on the streets, and see drug cartels run the show in the US, like they are doing in Mexico. It sounds like you've come here to cause destruction on Earth, the way you're putting all of this. Allow murderers to roam free because they pay their way out of their crimes? That will work well with hitmen, I suppose. Drug lords will love that idea. As mentioned, Manson (who had tons of followers) would've already been out. Work their way out of their crimes? They work in jail. They do laundry, make tags, work the yard, and are even driven to highways to pick up trash during the day. There's no way any of that will go down because the lives of innocent people are actually valuable.

Portland can't beat us as long as we have HCA in the playoffs. Houston can be trouble, but Yao's health is still a concern, and I'm not worried too much about Kevin Martin. If they get Melo, though? Big, big problem. The Spurs aren't the same. No Bowen, no idea how much Manu will even produce at any given time...just not the force they used to be. Phoenix is out of the question, and so are the Hornets, Clippers, Grizzlies, and with the number of players Utah lost, they are in the same boat. The Wolves, Kings and Warriors may not even make the playoffs. Denver won't even have Melo by the time April rolls in. Dallas is a big threat, but to be honest, I have really never had a reason to be worried about them while the Lakers are winning rings. Oklahoma City took us to six games, but Bryant had a swollen, fluid-filled knee for 4-5 of them. Durant will only get better, though, and so will Westbrook, so I have to say the Thunder are the biggest threat out West. With that established, I'm not going to break a sweat if we're 100% healthy.

My diabetic buddy! Hope the dude makes it. He's liable to go on a shooting spree if he doesn't grab a roster spot somewhere.