sas45champs

That's like a spot on comparison. Ah I loved Zo. His intangibles made him a winner. He just was so passionate about the game. Anytime Mourning gets injured, it's because he was playing basketball the hard-nosed way it should be played. Offensively, Mourning wins for me. He just had a better all-around offensive polish, even though he was probably just as explosive as Howard. But Mourning wasn't just limited from putback points, pick-and-roll, etc. He could score with his back to the basket and he got most of his points there. Also he actually had a bit of mid-range game, something Howard still lacks Howard is better on the boards though. Anyone who can pick up about 15 rebounds and 4 offensive rebounds is insane. Also, an argument people may use for Zo is that he was a better shot-blocker because he averaged more. However, I think that nowadays the refs are beginning to call more fouls in the shooters favor. Whether the block: foul ratios that favor Mourning is a matter of bad calls or better shot-blocking skill really isn't known. I really would pick either on the defensive end.

And Duncan is completely out of the picture? Mind, Duncan is the best big in the league at making his teammates better, something Bosh, Amare, Dirk lack. Leadership is underestimated in these ranks I'm seeing, as well as defense. All the power forwards benefit of the system that they are in. You wouldn't be able to put Amare in the slower paced system of the Spurs, and Duncan with the Knicks, for example. This is why it's hard to compose top 5 lists, because it depends on the standards you are basing it on. Defense? Duncan and Garnett are at the top. Offense? There are a variety of different offensive big men. If we're talking about faceup power-forwards, Bosh, Dirk, Gasol are probably the best. Traditional post up goes to Duncan and Garnett, although each has respectively lost a step. So Amare would be the pick-and-roll player, maybe the best of the group of players that have come up. If we were talking about the top 5 power forwards for a championship team, Amare is not in that category. I've never really seen many signs of leadership from him. Top 5 defensively, definitely not. But his explosive offense would put him in the offensive category, with Garnett taken out. That's Stoudemire's game.

My team, 11 team league: Tyreke Evans - got him in 3rd round, mediocre first game Richard Hamilton - shouldn't have drafted him 11th round, should've got Wilson Chandler Danny Granger - 1st round pick, has had two great performances Andray Blatche - 6th round, bad first game, maybe last year was fluke. Could be bust. Emeka Okafor - 9th round, needed a big man Marcus Thornton - 8th round, don't know why I drafted him Wesley Johnson - 10th round, he's doing decent Derrick Rose - 4th round, expecting great things when Boozer comes back Manu Ginobili - 5th round, had him last year and he was great, and my team name was I Ginobilieve, so I had to draft him haha Kevin Martin - 7th round he's a risk, but he's done very well in his first two games and I hope he doesn't get injured. Rajon Rondo - 2nd round pick, had a triple-double, averaging 16.7 apg, very happy with him Channing Frye - 12th round, I think he's a sleeper pick Derrick Favors - 14th round, had some solid rookie performances, and his minutes should start to go up Anthony Tolliver - 15th round, good first game but I predict inconsistency Andris Biedrins - dropped Chris Anderson for him. Biedrins is doing well, but they will limit his minutes like Yao so he doesn't get injured.

Yeah, I mean all of the Spurs players have had to start accepting a lesser role. Duncan has let Parker into the limelight, and Parker is sharing minutes with Hill. I always thought Parker was gonna be the first guy to demand a trade, but I was proven wrong after this.

Thanks for the welcome guys Good to see you TJ, ABL, and htown. I know we gonna ball it up like the old days @Jenneral what site? and what other usernames were you?

The Wolves are just a mess. Thank God they have a future in Johnson, Flynn, and Rubio when he comes over. So, the Wolves establish that they are in rebuild mode when they trade Kevin Garnett for Al Jefferson, who is posed as the franchise player, and some draft picks. I thought that was a step in the right direction, but why would they go ahead and trade Jefferson as well? Just for more draft picks and Koufos? And why would they even trade their 16th pick for Webster, since it seems all they are looking to do is get more draft picks? Webster's not gonna be anything special. I think the Wolves are seriously trying to bomb themselves into a top 5 pick each year.

This game is amazing. Everyone's talking about their players. I've made 3. My 1st player was an athletic SG 6'4 212, drafted 21st overall. Played for the Thunder, but the only problem is that when you put the difficulty on a higher setting(Hall of Fame), the opponents aren't harder, but your teammates are dumber. So I put it down to Superstar, and we still lose. Requested a trade, went to the Warriors. When I left the Thunder, we were 6-36 . And so far I am 67 overall with magazine endorsement. I think I'm averaging 21 points and 5 rebounds and 3 assists. And I get bored easily sometimes, so I'll make new players. My athletic PG was 6'4 180 drafted 20th. I haven't really played much with him, still in the circuit, probably work with him soon. And I made an athletic PF 6'9 250 drafted 22nd. I'm only like 8 games in and I already have a Jordan Billboard. And this one is on all-star cause I'm still trying to get used to the harder inside defense. The reason I make athletic players is because you don't need to use points on speed and vertical and stuff. Record is 6-3(I was injured one game). It proves that lower difficulty makes your teammates better.

It's a way of saying that he can let go of something he's worked so hard for. It's like giving someone cash straight up for their birthday to use his own money, it doesn't feel special or anything. Basically, he'll make one lucky person extremely happy, other people admiring his example, and he'll be helping people in charity. Everyone wins. I mean, tons of NBA players use their millions as charity, others may be doing it for the wrong publicity reasons. By giving his ring, it shows that he can truly let go.

I've watched the Spurs play for years now. If anything, their bench is one of their strengths. Everything you see this year in the regular season is not the Spurs full potential. You'll see the Spurs trying different rotations, Duncan, Manu, and Parker will take cuts in minutes. It's about who steps up. Hill made a name for himself last year. Blair worked hard and overcame his knee issues. Jefferson however, was the key guy who didn't step up. I expect him to become the player the Spurs traded for. Mason is no longer there, and we need Anderson to be that shooter. I'm really curious to see what Splitter will do. Acquisitions of Anderson, Splitter, and even Bobby Simmons will be key.

lol but yeah, Phil Jackson. He can turn selfish Kobe into team conceptual Kobe. He can take troubled Artest and make him humane(selling his championship ring to donate the money, even though Artest could just take his own money and give it away). He teaches one of the best offensive schemes. And yes, he has more rings than he has fingers.

This post is lengthy. If you have tolerance for reading a lot, go ahead and skip this little summary. If not, then my main point is that Tayshaun Prince is one of the best defenders in basketball and is seemingly shunned and forgotten, and this may be the case of several other defenders. Awards, stats, accomplishments don't paint the whole picture, and Prince is one of the best examples. I would have put this in the Pistons forum but there's a bigger topic to this than only Tayshaun Prince. But let's start with my initial idea. So I was watching the Pistons-Thunder game on the free league pass which turned out to be a greater game than I thought. Villa hit a 3 to surely win but poor defense on Green pushed the Thunder to win. Well I'm from Austin, Texas, so I'm a big KD fan. But I was also a huge fan of the guy guarding him: Tayshaun Prince. And I couldn't help but notice that KD was shut down the whole game. If you watched the game, shots that Durant normally would make over worse defenders would rim out. Not by poor shooting or shot selection, but because of the defensive intensity that Prince brought onto him. What makes Prince a great defender is his height(6'9), length(7'2 ws), and athleticism. The thing is, so many players have these things. What puts Prince ahead of them all is his hustle and intensity. That's what defense is in the NBA. Everyone has size, it's how you use your size. On initial stats, Durant looks like he dominated Prince with 30 points. But really, Durant was held to 9-24 shooting(37.5%) and he had 11 of his points from the free throw line, which are as it suggests, free points. Because there's no way you can't foul Durant, he's tall, athletic, it's hard to stop him without fouling him. Unfortunately the defensive posts of the Pistons didn't have the awareness to avoid fouls. In honesty, Prince is one of the greatest defenders of all time. People always get heated up when you talk about all-time, because people always seem to think that the 80's and 90's players were in a whole different league above the current players. Hell, Prince is a better defender than Kobe, Jordan, etc.(this isn't going to turn into a Prince-Jordan defense argument, is it?). Yet he what does he have to show for it? All he has is a 2004 ring, no stats or all-star appearances to show his elite defensive skill, one memorable highlight block that will be played for many years, and 4 All-NBA defensive second teams. People will say that his shutting down of Kobe Bryant in '04 was the whole great Piston's team defensive effort. And it was, but Prince should be given much of that credit. No stats to look back on. Defense is being seen more and more as stats, stats, stats, actually that's how the entire game as a whole is seen. He's never averaged 1 block or 1 steal, even though he deflects every pass and contests every shot and makes them miss. No all-star appearances. Basically, if you never made an all-star appearance, you were never elite in anything. A block on Reggie Miller? That had summed up everything Prince stood for on defense, everything defense stands for overall; not letting the other team score. Except it's not like Kobe or Jordan, whom in their highlight mixes have various steals and blocks and finishing with some 1 handed 360 dunk on the other end. Prince only has one highlight. But 4 All-NBA defense second teams outrages me the most. It just shows that accomplishments really don't show much at all. Basically, Prince will be remembered as a good defender, but never as a great one. He had to compete with possibly the two best perimeter defenders of the decade(Bowen and Battier), great post defenders(Garnett, Duncan, and help-defender Camby), and various of other names who I honestly think Prince is better than. 04-05 second team: Prince's first individual accomplishment in the league. Other defensive wings were AK47(stat stuffer), Bruce Bowen(legacy of great defense, pest, and maybe a little dirty), Dwyane Wade(2nd team), and Larry Hughes(1st). Larry Hughes? Dwyane Wade? These two are good playing the passing lanes. But Hughes took risks and as a result let up a score many times. He didn't have defensive intensity. Wade is a good defender...never shut down. Neither Hughes nor Wade can ever be called a shut-down defender. 05-06 second team: Bowen, AK, Kobe, Artest. Prince is just as great as any of them. Because Prince has not been exposed as an elite defender, many of you won't think that he is better or on the same level. All these players have the name-values as a defender due to superstardom(Kobe), influence(Artest), many 1st team appearances(Bowen) and stats(AK) 06-07: Bowen, Bryant, Bell. All 1st team. Bell was the self-proclaimed "Kobe-stopper." Last I checked, the true Kobe-stopper held him to 38% shooting, 17% from three, and forced him to commit 4 turnovers in the finals of 04. 07-08: Bryant, Bowen, Bell(2nd), Battier(2nd). We're seeing constant appearances of Bowen and Bryant. I would suppose that after a while, the GMs grow on these guys and just continue to vote for them over and over again, while they ignore defenders such as Battier and Prince who are just as great. After that, no more defensive team awards. 08-09, the entire first team was basically the all-NBA team. Dwyane Wade was suddenly elected again in '09 and '10. LeBron James is a good defender, but he is put because he can make the highlight reel. Like Wade. Never shut-down. Kobe is put again because he is Kobe. Just as you have to put Jordan on 1st team because he is Jordan. Josh Smith(2nd team in '10) is similar to LeBron. I liked the selection of Varejao, and Wallace should've always been on one of the teams. It showed that they had players that always worked 100% on the end, and the results are wins. I would definitely put Battier over Sef, and Prince, but I guess '10 is an exception due to his injuries. So basically, my main point is that awards and accomplishments show nothing. All it shows is what the people giving them think, and I believe the results are misleading. For instance, if such a great defender as Rasheed Wallace never makes one of these defensive teams, something is wrong. Basically, Wallace will never be given the credit on defense he deserves. Neither will Prince as well, when people are talking about the greatest defenders of all-time 20 years later, Prince's name won't come up. There's probably plenty of players who were better lock-down defenders than the names we know(or think) as great today. The funniest thing is I doubt that Prince even cares. He's a team player, and he doesn't work for himself as an individual. That's why so many teams want him as part of their franchise. That's why the Pistons hold on to him while getting rid of just about everyone else. That's why he's a true winner, and one of my favorite players of all time.

Yep. Loved that forum. Then I tried going to CTS but that's not there either.

Thanks y'all, yeah this was the only forum I remembered. Actually, I had to google AboveLegit to see what forum he was at haha. Known him for a couple of years.

Just because he isn't better than those PG's doesn't mean he's not underrated. In fact, that might argue the case for him being underrated more so than not. And I would not put Jennings over him, or Westbrook and Rose for that case ATM just because they haven't had the experience that Parker has had to lead a team like the Spurs to a ring. If Pop gives a player a leader role, he's a good player. Although he definitely isn't underrated, he still is a top 10 point guard. He's become underappreciated by Spurs fans. A lot of us say that Hill could lead the team just as well, but if that were the case, Pop would make that decision.

Hey guys So I haven't posted on forums for at least a year. Just wasn't something that I had time for. But I was watching some NBA and it encouraged me to talk a bit of basketball again, and of course NFL as well. I was at this site before but I didn't know where my account went. All the other forums I would used to post to are dead. I'm probably not gonna be active, that depends on how I manage my own time. But I hope I can talk basketball with what I know is a very smart community