Cleveland's Finest

http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/.element/media/2.0/teamsites/cavaliers/images/GoldUni_300.jpg Full Story They will wear them opening night against the Wizards. I kinda like them.

Full Story Good deal. Excited for the season!

Browns haven't won an opening game since returning to Cleveland. But that record has to be broken some time...so why not now? Positives going into this are that Joe Haden, Scott Fujita, and Trent Richardson will be playing, so we are technically at full strength.

If Collins means that Hawes should work on his mid-range shooting, then I understand. But Hawes has nowhere near the skills Gasol does. I think LaVoy Allen should get more playing time next season anyways. I don't see much in Hawes.

(FRI) Tennessee @ N.C. State (Off) Boise State @ Michigan State (-7.0) Notre Dame (-16.0) @ Navy Northwestern (-1.5) @ Syracuse Ohio @ Penn State (-6.5) Nevada @ California (-11.0) Miami (FL) (-2.0) @ Boston College Florida International @ Duke (-3.0) Clemson (-3.5) @ Auburn Michigan @ Alabama (-14.0) Wyoming @ Texas (-31.5) San Diego State @ Washington (-14.5) (SUN) Kentucky @ Louisville (-13.0) (SUN) SMU @ Baylor (-10.0) (MON) Georgia Tech @ Virginia Tech (-7.5)

That's like Derek Fisher saying he's a top 10 point guard when he was with LA during the three straight titles. Like Fisher, Chalmers is a great complimentary player who's fearless and loves getting shots in the big moments. If you put Chalmers with a team like Charlotte or Milwaukee, where he would be accountable for more of the team's success and have a bigger role, he probably wouldn't look as good. Nonetheless, it's good to have confidence.

Blake Griffin is extremely overrated here. At best he should be 5 on this list. Garnett and Duncan are still pretty darn good. They could be 4 or 5 here too.

Just started my second year at OSU...wont have as much time but I'll try to be active, especially for the NBA games.

I don't think LAL fears CP3. I really don't respect CP3 too highly. I know he has all this 'fight' in him, but he's very dirty at times and doesn't seem like a guy who can lead a team to championship heights. Personally won't be rooting for him.

I'll say 10-11 if you're looking at true success. Despite being hacked, we were resilient and managed to do what most boards would not be willing to do after a situation like we had. We stuck together and stuck with this board through the slowest times, and it now looks like it's growing again. Because of how this whole forum came together after the hack, we are able to go on here still and enjoy quality basketball discussion. It would have been easy to split and go to other forums, but not for us. The fact that we could do that while being in all different parts of the world is awesome.

If he can get his team into the playoffs this year, then yes. If not, then he's just a fine complementary all-star, which there's nothing wrong with.

10 team league....rate/hate QB: Drew Brees RB: Steven Jackson RB: Darren Sproles WR: Roddy White WR: Pierre Garcon TE: Antonio Gates Flex: Brandon Jacobs D/ST: 49ers K: David Akers Bench: QB: Matt Ryan RB: Donald Brown RB: Ahmad Bradshaw RB: James Starks WR: Greg Little WR: Brian Hartline TE: Jermaine Grasham

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQ9CoRQMPxw&sns=em Should he get punished? Thoughts?

LA has better offense, and Miami has better defense, and, as we know, defense wins championships. Just look at what Miami did to OKC last year. In terms of star power, LA has a little more though. But I'm going with the Heat. As much as I like Kobe and will be rooting for Antawn, I just don't know. If Kobe plays top notch, it's a different story.

At least we have someone who put Atlanta in there. I think I may be underestimating them. They now have a solid depth of guards with Lou Williams and Devin Harris. Smith and Horford are still all-stars candidates. With Morrow, Jenkins, and Korver they have a real threat at shooting threes well. Who knows if Ivan Johnson can do better too. Only problem is they don't have a center. I think Atlanta could also fight for the 8 seed, or even 7.

I forgot Bargnani was moving up to PF with Jonas there. You're right about that then.

You were telling me how important CJ Watson and Ronnie Brewer were, and I was addressing that those have been adequetely replaced. And to DDD: I see what you're saying. I was thinking more pure big men and not stretch 4's like Jamison.

I think Detroit and Washington will be much better this year, as will Milwaukee. I can see Toronto fighting for a playoff spot, but I'm not that confident that it can happen. Maybe I shouldn't have put them that low. I agree that he and Conley are similar, but when you say "top ten", it sounds like he's a lot better than he really is.

That's the best you got? Fine, we'll see when the season comes around.

Yes, because Lin's had very few chances, and Lowry's been in the league for seven years. Lin's been in the league for two, and has more room for growth. He won in under pressure atmospheres too. I think Lin's better than Lowry, but not by that much. I listed 12 or so point guards, so if Lin is 10 or 11 on that list, Lowry would be 11 or 12. Not far off at all.

My bad...I looked at a list of PGs and didn't scroll all the way down alphabetically. But yeah, that goes even further to show the level of talent at the point guard position. I don't have much regard for Lowry's breakout first-half of last season.

Because they will be beating up on the bottom of the East during the regular season, which will help them get a solid record. How many times last season did we see them give up under 90, or even under 80 points to the lowly teams in the East? They are going to be playing teams like Orlando, Detroit, Cleveland, Washington, Toronto, Atlanta, Charlotte, etc...3-4 times next season, and they should be able to manhandle them defensively. And I thought the Knicks would win the East because I had more faith in Carmelo. I learned that Carmelo isn't someone you can buy into just yet. A lot of people thought Carmelo and Amare would work out too. The Bulls are going to make games ugly and scrappy. They added Nate Robinson who will be a much bigger impact than most think. Taj Gibson will finally get some big playing time, and he will be a beast. Jimmy Butler was solid in the small amounts of chances he got last season, and he could certainly make up for most of the losses from Brewer being gone. Hinrich is a big upgrade over Watson. Plus, Richard Hamilton missed over half of last season, and they still finished 50-16. Assuming he's healthy, there's another player to make up for the losses. Also, Deng won't be playing with a messed up wrist like he did last season. Belinelli is yet another guard who they added who can shoot threes. Their three big men (Boozer, Gibson, and Noah) is the best group of bigs in the league if you're ranking top threes. Add Mohammed and Radmanovic, who will play small minutes, and I think they are fine without Asik. I'm relying on the Bulls championship pedigree during this Rose era, and also on what I saw during all the injuries last season. I also really think they made up for their losses (besides Rose) in free agency. And like I said, they will be playing some bad teams, and I also think that they will be able to tough it out against teams like Brooklyn, New York, and Philly just enough to finish above them. I am confident that the Bulls will finish with home court advantage. I think it's unfair to disregard them just because another "super team" in Brooklyn formed.

I really don't think Lowry is even a top 10 pg (Rondo, Paul, Parker, Rose, Westbrook, Irving, Nash, Lin, Conley, Billups, Lawson, and Rubio). I'd put him in the 2nd tier with guys like Holliday, Collison, Geroge Hill, I think he was good last year, but he's not going to be an all-star due to the amount of elite point guards. They got better at point guard, but it isn't that big of an improvement to where they'll get that many more wins. I don't think I said the Cavs improved more than Toronto. The Cavs did nothing, and I hate it. But I still don't see anything special about Toronto. At best, they finish 9th or 10th. They are not making the playoffs. As of now I have the Cavs finishing higher than Toronto. Imo they have a better point guard, power forward, and center in the starting lineup. Varejao played like an all-star before he got hurt. Thompson was arguably the second best "rookie" last year (discounting Rubio), and Irving will be an elite pg soon. I just think you guys have unrealistic expectations. The Raptors have been a lowly team for awhile now and I don't see Lowry and Jonas digging them out of it the first year there. Fields is a solid role player at best. The Cavs, meanwhile, have a system established and are now building. The fact that there isn't much turnover from last season's Cavs is why I think they'll be better.

What's being heavily underestimated is defense and coaching, how bad the bottom of the East is, and how well this group played together without Rose and Hamilton for a majority of the season. Will it win them a title? Probably not, but it will make them a force in the East.

East 1. Miami Heat 2. Boston Celtics 3. Chicago Bulls 4. Philadelphia 76ers 5. New York Knicks 6. Brooklyn Nets 7. Indiana Pacers 8. Milwaukee Bucks 9. Detroit Pistons 10. Cleveland Cavaliers 11. Washington Wizards 12. Atlanta Hawks 13. Orlando Magic 14. Toronto Raptors 15. Charlotte Bobcats West 1. Oklahoma City Thunder 2. San Antonio Spurs 3. Los Angeles Lakers 4. Denver Nuggets 5. Dallas Mavericks 6. Los Angeles Clippers 7. Memphis Grizzlies 8. Utah Jazz 9. Houston Rockets 10. Minnesota Timberwolves 11. Phoenix Suns 12. Golden State Warriors 13. New Orleans Hornets 14. Portland Trail Blazers 15. Sacramento Kings Now, this is for the regular season. I have LA at third because Dwight will miss the first month or so of the season and it will take time to get Kobe and Nash to adjust together. A couple other thoughts: In the East, the Bulls are being heavily underestimated. The Heat are in a complete joke of a division; it may be the worst I have ever seen. I didn't realize how little the Pacers did in the offseason, so I put Brooklyn and New York over them. The 8 seed will be anyone's game. I can see any team, even Charlotte, somehow being in the race. That's how bad the bottom of the East is. I don't think any of those teams will finish with winning records. In the West, picking the standings is pretty hard. San Antonio could very well finish first again, but I think OKC will be a little bit better. Denver is being underestimated more than Chicago. Dallas, LAC, and Memphis are wild cards. All three could wind up fighting for the 3-4 seeds if all things fall into place for them. I think Utah will make the playoffs, just because they have a lot of depth. I really like what Houston did with its draft picks and signings of Asik, Delfino, and Lin. Phoenix and Minnesota could maybe slide into the playoffs if Utah becomes a seller. The bottom of the West is rebuilding, and won't play a role.