[Completed] Greatest center in NBA history?

[Real Deal]

Be sure to bold your vote, then follow it up with an argument as to why you believe he is deserving of the vote.

[Warren2ThaG]

Shaquille O'Neal

----

He was unstoppable on a daily basis, and can also break down a hoop.

[bigdog17k]

Shaq, pretty easy one here. Just look at what he's accomplished, plus his stats don't lie.

[Real Deal]

If the stats don't lie, why not Wilt?

 

I think many should make an argument for a guy that averaged 50 PPG in a season, and thumped everyone rebounding...but then, I suppose you have to look at the competition as well.

 

Bill Russell has 11 rings. He'd be one to consider.

[deestillballin]

I have to go with Bill Russell here. Although time frames were diffrent he is the all time leader in rings with 11. Also leading Boston to 8 straight NBA Finals win (correct me if im wrong there, i think it was 8 straight). You cant deny it his shot blocking was one of the keys to the Celtics success back then. And who is the NBA Finals MVP trophey named after... nuff said

[Celtics3420]

Bill Russell

 

Arguably the best defensive anchor in NBA history. Led a dominant Celtics team to 8 straight rings, and an unprecedented 11/13 as a player/coach. You can argue wilt, but Wilt also played against russell and Russell's Celtics always beat up on Wilt's sixers. Could go either way, but my choice is Russell.

[TheNextBestThing]

Shaquille O'Neal. Statistics are nice, and so are wins. Of course, today's NBA is not the same league that Russell and Wilt dominated. Shaq's ability to simply overpower his defender is something that you just can't ignore, but people forget that he didn't just rely on his physicality. Shaq has an arsenal of moves, and is one of the best passing centers ever.

 

If Josh Smith had played decades ago, people would be considering him one of the best ever to play the game. The same is true of Gerald Wallace, Danny Granger, or Rudy Gay. I realize that Russell captured a dozen championships, and Wilt scored 50 every night, but it's not fair to compare their competition to what Shaq faced. And destroyed.

[JWaLL]

Shaquille O'Neal. The most dominant center who ever played. In his prime, it was almost unfair to have him on the floor.

[Clutch]

Kareem the most consistently dominant player since he started playing basketball in friggin highschool -- and master of the skyhook..experienced success everywhere he went..most league mvp's - the captain gets my vote...he is the definition of "float like a butterfly and sting like a bee"

[Big Penny]

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar alltime leader in Points, 3rd in Rebounds and Blocked shots, played into his 40s, and was still quite effective (although not amazing.). won a ton of rings and created the almost unblockable sky-hook. how does 28/17/5/4 sound?

[ChosenOne]

Shaqin his prime was the best player in the NBA with out a doubt. He could not be stopped by one guy many times 2 would not be the magic number either.

[Lkr]

Shaq, just over Kareem, because he was just so damn dominant. Nobody could stop him, including guys taller and stronger than him.

[The Regime]

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, he was the definition of consistency. He's most famously known for his sky hook, which to date is still one of the toughest shots to defend. He holds a record 6 MVP's and still hold the career scoring mark at 38,387 points. And check this out.....Kareem remains the only modern era player to lead the league at least once in scoring, rebounding, blocked shots, minutes played, field-goal percentage and PER. That's ridiculous.

[EastCoastNiner]

I have a hard time voting in these types of polls because of different era's, so I end up viewing "greatest" and "best" completely differently.

 

I think greatness is based upon what you have accomplished over your entire career, such as awards and championships, which would put Wilt Chamberlain, Bill Russel, and Kareem Abdul Jabar at the top of this list.

 

However, I view being the "best" as which player was the most skilled, regardless of the competition, and if you put them in any era, they would still be the best, and to me, that is Shaquille O'Neal.

 

He optimized pure dominance, and I don't think that any of the other centers in this discussion could come close to stopping him in his prime.

 

So, even though I'm contradicting myself a little, I'll go with Shaquille O'Neal, but it's not that big of a contradiction considering he has won multiple awards and championships.

[AboveLegit]

I remember reading a great article written by BFT about this topic, and he chose Kareem Abdul Jabbar. After reading it, I was convinced.

 

1. Wilt was a giant, he was 7'2 in an era where other centers were 6'7, maybe 6'8. Willis Reed was a hall of fame center and he was 6'9 and 235 pounds. That's Kurt Thomas for crying out loud.

 

2. There was no three second violation. Wilt was allowed to just camp in the lane, and since he was taller than everyone it made for an easy entry pass. All big men scored at a ridiculously high percentage but Wilt was able to get the most inside passes because of his size advantage and the fact that he didnt have to move away from the basket.

 

3. He played in an era with a high scoring pace, more shots per minute lead to more point and rebound opportunities, which leads to bloated stats. All starting front court players averaged AT LEAST 10 rebounds, lets not forget this is the same era oscar averaged his triple double either.

 

And as for all the Shaq lovers out there, he may be the most dominant of any era, but he doesn't have the longevity that most of the great centers had.

 

So, I will go with Kareem Abdul Jabbar.

Edited March 12, 2010 by AboveLegit

[kingfish]

Kareem because he had the dominance, fundamentals, and longevity in his career. Shaq doesnt come close, but he is 2nd.

[YugoRocketsFan]

Where the hell is Hakeem? The best defensively, most agile big man ever, won 2 rings, didnt have a super talented squad around him, skill-wise he is the best center ever.

[Built Ford Tough]

I wrote a little article about this, the one that AboveLegit is refering to, back in the summer and I figured I'd post it here. Obviously Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is my pick considering the title of the article was "Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: The Greatest Big Man Ever", haha.

 

Anyways, here it is:

 

Personally, I think that Kareem is the GOAT big man. Almost everybody will give the distinction of the GOAT big man to either Bill Russell or Wilt Chamberlain. Who do you think is the greatest big man to ever play the game?

 

As I said above, I think that Kareem is the best big ever, and here is why:

 

When you decipher between plyers in All Time rankings, there really isn't one thing that is the deciding factor (at least not for me). If you just value statistics, then you would go with Wilt Chamberlain. If you just value winning/accomplishments then you have to go with Bill Russell. If it is all about individual talent, then it would be Hakeem Olajuwon. If it was dominating the paint like no other, then it would be Shaquille O'Neal. I think that in order to be considered the best, you have to factor in a combonation of these things, and really, is there anybody in the history of the sport that has the combonation of dominance, talent and accomplishments that Kareem has? He resume is a thing of legend if you ask me. Just look at what he has accomplished in his basketball career:

 

3 straight HS titles going 96–6 including a 72 game winning streak

3 straight NCAA titles and a couple of player of the year awards

6X NBA Champ

2X Finals MVP

6X NBA MVP (finished top 5 in voting 15 times

NBA Rookie of the Year

19X All Star

10X First Team All-NBA

5X Second Team All-NBA

5X All-Defensive First Team

6X All-Defensive Second Team

NBA's All Time leader in points (38,387)

3rd All Time in rebounds (17,440)

3rd All Time in blocks (3,189)

35/17/5 player in his prime

Career Averages of 24.6 ppg 11.2 rbg 3.6 apg 55FG% and 72FT%

 

People considered the weakest part of Kareem's game to be his rebounding and defense, yet the man made 11 All Defensive Teams in his career (which is the most out of any player to ever play the game), is the third leading rebounder of All-Time and the third leading shot blocker of All-Time despite the fact that blocks weren't kept as a statistic for the first 4 seasons of his career. In fact, if blocks were kept as a stat during the first 4 seasons of his career, he would actually be the All Time leader in blocked shots with roughly 4,042 blocks (if you want proof of that I will show you my calculations). When you are an All Time great at the area that was considered to be the weakest part of your game, that means you are a [expletive]ing legend.

 

He is the most durable player to ever play the game. Not only did he play for two decades (and was an All Star in every season except for one), but to put into perspective just how much longevity he had, Kareem made All-NBA First Team over Wilt Chamberlain, Moses Malone, Hakeem Olajuwon and Patrick Ewing. Kareem played against players from the 50's as well as players that played into the 2000's. That is just unreal.

 

The only player to ever win more than Kareem was Bill Russel. The only players that had better statistical numbers than him were Wilt Chamberlain and Elgin Baylor. However, no player that won more than him was as skilled or an overall dominant player like he was and no player that was better statistically won even close to what he won. That is the ultimate combination if you ask me.

 

The way that I look at it, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is basically the Michael Jordan of big men. You can't really look at any area of his game and say "well he didn't do this well". He had no flaws in his game. He holds defensive records, rebounding records, shot blocking records and offensive records. People will argue that the only reason he holds any of these records is because of his longevity, but they seem to forgot that during his prime, Abdul-Jabbar was a 35/17/5/4 player and he was a winner while doing this. He wasn't like Oscar Robertson where he just put up godly numbers on crappy teams that weren't going anywhere.

 

Kareem was considered to be the best player in the league for probably close to 15 years and even when he was past his prime with the Lakers, he was still their go to guy. I know that he wasn't their leading scorer at times, but make no mistake about it, when the Lakers were in need of a basket, it was the skyhook that they turned to time and time again and more than not, he would come through because he was a very clutch player.

 

People will try to bring up the fact that he played with Magic Johnson and Oscar Robertson (who was past his prime with Kareem anyways) but Kareem does have 6 Championships and none of these other players have a title without Kareem on their roster. Now I hate it when people say so and so can't win without so and so because this is a team game and you need a team to win, so I am not trying to discredit Magic by any means because Kareem needed him just as much as Magic needed Kareem. I am just trying to point out that this is a terrible argument.

 

You prove yourself vs Wilt. You prove yourself vs Hakeem. You win 6 titles. You put up video game numbers. You win 6 MVPs. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, you are the greatest big man to ever play the game.

Edited March 13, 2010 by Built Ford Tough

[ChosenOne]

Shaq, just over Kareem, because he was just so damn dominant. Nobody could stop him, including guys taller and stronger than him.

 

There was no one stronger than shaq in his prime, and that is possibly true right now as well.

[AboveLegit]

Where the hell is Hakeem? The best defensively, most agile big man ever, won 2 rings, didnt have a super talented squad around him, skill-wise he is the best center ever.

Skill wise, but Kareem was much more dominant.

[TheNextBestThing]

Where the hell is Hakeem? The best defensively, most agile big man ever, won 2 rings, didnt have a super talented squad around him, skill-wise he is the best center ever.

 

 

Skill-wise? Yes, he might be the best. And that's enough to get into the top 5 ever. But his physical inferiority keeps him safely behind Shaq.

 

In fact, it was Hakeem himself who, after playing against rookie Shaq, conceded that Shaq was the strongest man he had ever seen.

[AboveLegit]

Skill-wise? Yes, he might be the best. And that's enough to get into the top 5 ever. But his physical inferiority keeps him safely behind Shaq.

 

In fact, it was Hakeem himself who, after playing against rookie Shaq, conceded that Shaq was the strongest man he had ever seen.

 

Hakeem was at the back end of his prime when he faced Shaq who was at his physical peak... and Hakeem did away with him easily in the finals. Hakeem was more polished than Shaq in every way, be it offensively or defensively. A lot less holes in his game. A lot less ego and a lot more class also for him as well.

 

Hakeem's the most skilled offensive and defensive force the league has ever seen at the center position... Talk all you want about Shaq's domination... Shaq faced lesser quality big men and old centers in his prime. Hakeem, other than Ben Wallace, was the only center with enough lateral quickness and footwork to check guards on the perimeter. Hakeem was a great defender of the pick and roll and obviously the all time leader in shots blocked at the rim.

 

Hakeem all day... under any circumstance. I need a bucket at the end of the game... I go to him... If he's fouled, he'll hit his free throws. Hakeem could hit shots from all over the court, therefore he's also the bigger threat down the stretch of a nailbiter... In the same way that you would go to Tim Duncan before Shaq in the clutch.

 

Think about it... Is there one weakness you can point out with Hakeem? I mean really. I know people love Shaq and his style/dunks, but Hakeem is without a doubt the better ballplayer.

[fish7718]

I love Kareem and I think he is the most talented 7 footer to ever play the game. I love shaq and I think he's the most dominant player to ever command the paint in the game. However, the great center to ever play basketball has got to be Wilt Chamberlian.

 

I love how people knock on Wilt like he used to play in an era when only men of 6 foot or less played in the NBA. Believe it or not people 7 footers did roam the earth back in the 1960's it's not just a new fad. Wilt could do everything and statistically speaking its a joke to put him up against anyone. People say 20 10 is a great year for a center, Wilt used to average 50 27. I mean that's just beyond video game insane thats godly. They said he couldn't pass so he averaged 7+ assists for back to back years too. Wilt was probably one of the most athletic big men ever. The NBA changed the rule that you can't cross the free throw line at any time when shooting because Wilt used to run up and dunk it from the free throw line. Seriously Shaq and Kareem are nice but it's gotta go to Wilt, and if he doesn't win I am going to pull a Kanye West .

 

Oh yeah and Wilt vs Shaq Wilt 2 PF a game Shaq 3.4

[Cleveland's Finest]

Shaq is/was the most massive, powerful force in the NBA. He won 4 rings so far and his presence on the defensive end keeps teams from getting easy points. Offensively, he did whatever he wanted once he was in the post.

[Real Deal]

Shaq - 8

Kareem - 6

Russell - 2

Wilt - 1

Hakeem - 1

 

Any more votes?