Knicks ask Trump to recruit LeBron

[Nitro]

It's my opinion though that I think LeBron is looking to be the first NBA billionaire as a player. You can disagree, I understand.

 

I know this, and it proves my point.

 

1) If LeBron's primary goal is to be the first NBA billionaire as a player, he will NEVER be considered the greatest player who has ever lived, or even the greatest player of his generation.

 

2) Status is attained by what you do in your sport, not how high your exposure is off the court or how much money you make. Jordan made $90,200,000 over his career on the court...LeBron had a $90M contract with Nike months before he ever stepped on an NBA court as an 18 year-old. When Jordan first retired he was considered the greatest ever and a marketing icon...and he was only taking in $4M a year. When he re-entered the game he was taking in a staggering $30M a year, but my point is that money and exposure don't mean more than winning and TRULY dominating a sport.

 

3) Why has Jordan made so much money since retiring? Why has his brand flourished even after his 40" vertical jump and 50pt games went away? There have been plenty of freak athletes who have put up ridiculous stats in NBA history, but what set Jordan apart and what has kept his brand going is the 6 rings and countless career accolades. His titles coupled with his talent made him a legend. Take the titles away, and he's just an upgraded Dr. J. Hell, most people under 20 years old don't even remember Jordan as a player, just some old highlights. But they DO remember the legacy, something Bron hasn't even began to touch and will never touch if he doesn't WIN.

 

Even from basketball perspective, it's kind of presumptuous to assume Knicks don't have what it takes to compete. It's not about winning right away, I do think it's about where to win.

 

KG actually gave LeBron some of the best advice I've heard, saying, "You can't get your youth back." James is entering his 8th NBA season...that was just about the athletic prime for Kobe. For T-Mac, with all his potential and freakish ability, he only declined after his 8th season due to injuries. Garnett hit his highest point his 9th season and only declined after that. LeBron, a person whose offensive game is so dependant on athletic ability (as opposed to say Kobe, whose unmatched basketball skills negated the athletic decline), should be looking to win NOW. One bad injury and his career will never be the same. You can't just assume the guy will be averaging 30/8/8 for the next decade, it just won't happen.

 

And it's not the fact that the Knicks won't have what it takes to compete as over half the roster still needs to be signed. I'm just saying that their ridiculous tactics to lure him are embarassing and won't help sway Bron's decision.

Edited June 18, 2010 by Nitro1118

[NomarFachix]

I'm just saying that their ridiculous tactics to lure him are embarassing and won't help sway Bron's decision.

 

Ms. Cleo? That you?

[Nitro]

Ms. Cleo? That you?

 

No one needs to tell LeBron that NY is the country's largest and most lucrative market. No one needs to tell LeBron that the fans are the best in the league. No one needs to tell LeBron the legend he could be if he won a few titles in NY.

 

If he wants to be a billionaire and wants that added fame (which is already on such a disgusting level), then he already knows NY is the spot. He knows WHEREVER he goes he will be worshiped. If he cares about winning, then it'll all come down to who has the best combo of GM/coach/supporting cast of players with both a short and long term plan.

[NomarFachix]

You sidestepped the question.

[Nitro]

You sidestepped the question.

 

It doesn't take a mind-reader to know that LeBron knows what to expect in NY from every perspective except on the basketball court. I'm sure all these crazy tactics to lure him are flattering, but if he wants to win, he'll go to a mid-large market that offers him the best shot to win. That could be NY, but with half the roster yet to be signed, that's impossible to know yet. If he values the "other" stuff like being a billionaire and all that more than winning, then NY is the clear favorite to land him. Neither of those scenarios change with all these flatteries.

 

Also, considering the Knicks have made every decision in the last 2-3 years in effort to land LeBron, that should be flattering enough.

[NomarFachix]

:sigh:

[fish7718]

:sigh:

I believe the answer was "Yes, I am Ms.Cleo" she just doesn't want to admit it's really her!

 

SO WHAT TEAM IS LEBRON GOING TO NITRO!?

[Nitro]

SO WHAT TEAM IS LEBRON GOING TO NITRO!?

 

If he wants to be a billionaire and marketing giant, New York. If he wants to win, we'll have to see how the draft and beginning of free agency begin.

 

Gotta love NY fans, though. Freak the [expletive] out everytime someone thinks anything differently of LeBron going to NY. All the years of bombing in hopes of being able to lure the King, I understand why you guys are so touchy about it on the web, in the papers and everytime I listen to WFAN. An entire decade of being the worst run, most embarassing orginization in the league wiped clean over signing a league MVP. Understandable.

 

And if they don't land him or Wade, it will be without a doubt the funniest thing every other NBA fan has ever seen.

[NomarFachix]

If he wants to be a billionaire and marketing giant, New York. If he wants to win, we'll have to see how the draft and beginning of free agency begin.

 

Gotta love NY fans, though. Freak the [expletive] out everytime someone thinks anything differently of LeBron going to NY. All the years of bombing in hopes of being able to lure the King, I understand why you guys are so touchy about it on the web, in the papers and everytime I listen to WFAN. An entire decade of being the worst run, most embarassing orginization in the league wiped clean over signing a league MVP. Understandable.

 

And if they don't land him or Wade, it will be without a doubt the funniest thing every other NBA fan has ever seen.

 

We're the ones scorned, but he's writing essays with every post and defending his own points before anyone even says anything... lol, calling him Ms. Cleo is "freaking the [expletive] out". Get lost.

 

Go write in some other team's HQ.

[Nitro]

We're the ones scorned, but he's writing essays with every post and defending his own points before anyone even says anything... lol, calling him Ms. Cleo is "freaking the [expletive] out". Get lost.

 

Go write in some other team's HQ.

 

To quote just one line of my post and asking me if I'm Ms. Cleo without defending why all that crap WOULD help lure LeBron to NY is a contradiction in itself. I don't 100% know, neither do you, and to bypass all the actual points I made in my post to nitpick one line is stupid. Just like the Knicks hiring a committee to lure LeBron.

[NomarFachix]

I don't 100% know

 

Ding ding ding, we have a winner.

[Nitro]

Ding ding ding, we have a winner.

 

Once again, nitpicking one part of my post without addressing the actual substance.

 

Now that we got that out of the way, please tell me the following- Do you honestly think that without all these crazy tactics to lure him that LeBron doesn't already know what it means to be a winner in NY? To play in front of the best crowd in the league? To play at the world's most famous arena? To play in front of celebrities?

 

If he already knows those things, then what difference does having a committee and doing all these crazy things to lure him mean? He already knows every single team in the NBA and their fans want him, and the Knicks making every roster move in the last 2 years to land him without verbal committment is the ultimate flattery. That is why I have 0 belief that all these tricks the Knicks are playing to land him mean ANYTHING, and will make non difference in if he decides to go to NY or not.

[NomarFachix]

Once again, nitpicking one part of my post without addressing the actual substance.

 

You dressed up opinion as fact and marked it down. If calling you on it is "nitpicking", I guess that's what it was.

[fish7718]

Once again, nitpicking one part of my post without addressing the actual substance.

 

Now that we got that out of the way, please tell me the following- Do you honestly think that without all these crazy tactics to lure him that LeBron doesn't already know what it means to be a winner in NY? To play in front of the best crowd in the league? To play at the world's most famous arena? To play in front of celebrities?

 

If he already knows those things, then what difference does having a committee and doing all these crazy things to lure him mean? He already knows every single team in the NBA and their fans want him, and the Knicks making every roster move in the last 2 years to land him without verbal committment is the ultimate flattery. That is why I have 0 belief that all these tricks the Knicks are playing to land him mean ANYTHING, and will make non difference in if he decides to go to NY or not.

He doesn't know. To be honest. How could he? He has never played to New York, he doesn't know how New York can increase his profits exponentially. Don't come into our HQ and hate on us, it's mean.

[Multi-Billionaire]

Again, your point here is made via a fan's perspective, not necessarily seeing it from LeBron's point of view. I never said being a billionaire is his primary goal, but both winning NBA title/ being a success in the sport and becoming a billionaire should have the same/ similar weight in his decision-making. We "wanted" MJ to finish his career as a Bull, with a shot over Bryon Russell to win his 6th title viewed as a perfect to end a career for the greatest player ever. But realistically, what we want of players are not necessarily what the players want of themselves (I think that's common sense and I know you understand it) because we're seeing it from a fan's point of view. We want our favorite players to be "perfect", to have shiny individual stats, to be a legend so we can boast them to our peers, to have "unblemished/ without a fault" career. But do we care about what restaurant/ businesses they open, do we care about where they want to live, do we care about what school they choose for their children? No, we don't care about any aspect of their lives (including namely the financial aspect) except their sport career.

 

My point is: to us fans, I will agree with what you say

is attained by what you do in your sport, not how high your exposure is off the court or how much money you make

... because that's what we want LeBron/ superstars to be... that's not necessarily how they want themselves to be.

 

An example here is: credit card companies are now seizing Antoine Walker's last remaining items, cars, houses, clothes, and even his one and only NBA ring. Walker is not the only one. Randy Brown of the Bulls also went bankrupt he was auctioning his NBA rings!

 

 

This is what Rick Reilly has in his article:

 

Filing for bankruptcy is a long-standing tradition for NBA players, 60% of whom, according to the Toronto Star, are broke five years after they retire. The other 40% deliver the Toronto Star.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/espnmag/story?id=3469271

 

 

SIXTY (60%!) of NBA players go broke 5 years after they retire. That's a staggering number (to be honest, I didn't realize it was this big). It shows they are many rich people who can't manage their money and stay rich.

 

You can win $100,000 lottery and think "you're rich" and yet have it all flat in 3 days... you can win a bigger amount $1,000,000 and do the same, and probably in less time. My point here: it's not logical to think that if LeBron has $200-300 mil and then assume he will never be bankrupt, "he should be good for the rest of his life and he should be satisfied with $200-300 mil". It's not fair in a way because we're speaking from a middle-class perspective ($25K - 100K a year). To us who earn middle-class money, obviously $200-300 mil is a huge amount of money that we THINK we will never be able to spend in a lifetime. But if by some luck you have $200-300 mil in your bank account all of a sudden today, to think you'll never be bankrupt is naive. You'd only end up in the 60%, not the 40%. If you have $200-300 mil, you would have to elevate your financial level of thinking to a person with that level of wealth, not still with middle-class perspective, otherwise you'd lose money left and right.

 

 

I'm sure, if you were in LeBron's position, FINANCIALLY, you would be aware of this fact... that 60% of NBA players go broke 5 years after they retire. If you were LeBron you want to be involved in your own financial aspect and not just hand it over to the "professionals" who can screw you anytime. Therefore, if you were LeBron you also would aim as high as possible FINANCIALLY... what better than to be a billionaire?

 

 

We think pro athlete's status is attained by what they do in their sports. But do the players themselves think as we do? Not necessarily. Sure we think they're plain losers if they don't... but for me, I can't say Antoine Walker is a winner in his life, if he's at this point financially although he was a winner in his career: an All Star appearance, solid career, a ring. If we say Walker is a winner, then it's somehow selfish on our part, because that would say when it comes to scrutinizing Walker, all we care about him is his basketball career, and we don't care about anything else about his life.

 

You might be a basketball legend, but what good is that status if you were leading a depressing life financially and have to sell your rings?

 

 

Magic Johnson is what embodies a true success. He was an NBA superstar, he played in the 80s where players would dream to be a "millionaire"... he has been a superstar on the court and off the court. He was a superstar as a player, but people say he's even better than the player he was as a businessman. I believe his networth is somewhere around $500-750 mil. Now, that's status.

 

 

Mark my words, judging by their lifestyles, Allen Iverson and especially Eddy Curry are next to declare bankruptcy. If they don't know how to manage their money, and continue to maintain their current lifestyle... they will end up in the 60%. In other words, if you don't care about money, money won't care about you.

 

If you were LeBron, finance has to be an important aspect in your decision-making. What's important to LeBron in making decisions is not what the fans think, but it's what LeBron (and his team) think. In other words, does LeBron prioritize winning multiple titles over the possibility of going broke 5 years after he retires? I don't think so.

 

 

I'm not saying LeBron would go broke if he chooses to win over his financial aspect. That's not a guarantee... but to say a player's status is attained only by what they do in their sport is not speaking from all parties' view... but only from a fan's view... which is limited.

 

 

And besides, you can't convince me you can say to a billionaire with a straight face, "you're a loser".

[Multi-Billionaire]

He doesn't know. To be honest. How could he? He has never played to New York, he doesn't know how New York can increase his profits exponentially. Don't come into our HQ and hate on us, it's mean.

 

"Expontentially". I love that word. :glasses:

[Nitro]

We "wanted" MJ to finish his career as a Bull, with a shot over Bryon Russell to win his 6th title viewed as a perfect to end a career for the greatest player ever.

 

MJ returned to the Wizards because he was a big part of their management and he wanted to single-handedly bring the franchise back to prominance. The money was not the issue, as he accepted $1M in each of his 2 seasons with the Wizards. That's MJ's competitive spirit going out of control (and trust me, if there was any chance of his body being able to give the Bobcats 20-30MPG, he'd be back on the hardwood). And as badly as fans wanted his legacy to end with the shot over Russel, there is no one that didn't want to see him back in the NBA again. He got louder cheers at opponent arenas on every shot make than the hometown players got.

 

My point is: to us fans, I will agree with what you say ... because that's what we want LeBron/ superstars to be... that's not necessarily how they want themselves to be.

 

I am not going to quote your entire post and dissect everything, so I'll sum it up...

 

My point is that for LeBron to reach that unprecendented level of superstardom from a financial/marketing aspect, he has to win. Right now he is still viewed as a prodigy with the untapped potential to be a true legend. Because of this he has, for the most part, gotten a pass for not winning a championship(s). Now entering his 8th season he is starting to feel that pressure.

 

He went from being the concensus best player in the NBA in April to a distant 2nd in May. Kobe went from being considered washed up/inferior to Kevin Durant in April to arguably GOAT in June. Really the only thing that changed in that time was a poor, weak-hearted performance against the Celtics by LeBron, and Kobe playing through various injuries and playing his [expletive] off en route to yet another championship. People have incredibly short-term memories, but my point is fans value championships and heart above everything else. And what the fan wants directly dictates a player's success in his life off the court. If LeBron doesn't win championships, then his financial success and fame off the court will come to a screeching halt once he declines/retires.

 

And honestly, I really don't think LeBron is worrying about going bankrupt. He's a smart, sensible guy, and the reason for him wanting to be a billionaire is not to prevent bankruptcy. Rather it is status, as you mentioned. But how many retired athletes still in the spotlight DON'T have rings? The only one I can think of is Charles Barkley, but that's because of his personality and ability to be a legend on the mic. Otherwise, the athletes who are relevant from a marketing/financial aspect in retirement are there because they showed all-around dominance of their sport, which includes championships.

 

Basically, if LeBron wants to reach the goal of being the most prolific athlete of all-time from an off the court standpoint, he needs to perform as the most prolific player of all-time on the court. There have been so many outstanding athletes that have dominated their sport from a production standpoint yet crucified because they didn't win (T-Mac, KG pre-Celtics, A-Rod pre-2009, etc...). T-Mac is so far out of the spotlight now and has 0 chance to redeem himself, which is a shame because he was a guy that was able to put up 32/6/6 in 2002-2003 and have the world at his fingertips. Had KG and A-Rod failed to get those championships, they would have always been viewed as elite talents that could never achieve the ultimate goal of winning a ring. They would have had "status" until retirement, when a new generation of possibly even greater talents came along to steal the spotlight. W

 

What seperates elite players from elite players, both on and off the court, is winning.

Edited June 19, 2010 by Nitro1118

[NomarFachix]

Go awayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

 

You write some Judy Bloom novels in here, dude, and I don't read them

[Multi-Billionaire]

I wouldn't disagree with your points, mainly that winning has to do with a player's marketing and financial success.

 

 

But I need to point out that New York is a substantially bigger marketing city... it could be 10x as big as the second biggest one. It's not only in New York itself, but the endorsement/ marketing connections New York has with international cities are substantially bigger than, say, Chicago. Those connections are what make you "exponentially" rich. That's why I like that word as quoted above. Let's say in Chicago you can get 10 endorsements, in New York you can probably get 15 endorsements, which are not far off... but each endorsement in New York branches to several endorsements overseas with New York as its headquarters. From those 15 endorsements, they branch out to 30 which then branch out to 60, and so on. It is not "incremental" wealth building, but "exponential".

 

The difference between being a superstar in Chicago and in New York is seen as insignificant/ "only 5 endorsement difference" via the normal eyes, but it's actually HUGE/ actually MASSIVE if you consider these links these New York firms have with the rest of the world. I don't think Chicago or Los Angeles (Clippers), big as they are in USA, are as accessible to the world business-wise. Let's not forget that New York is pretty much the business capital of the world.

 

To put it in perspective, it would probably took LeBron until after he retires, and that is if he's financially savvy, to become a billionaire if he's playing outside New York. But it could very well take him only 6-7 years from now to achieve it in New York. The marketing difference between New York vs outside New York is that HUGE.

 

 

Other than that, I would agree with you winning (a championship) would be a big one to his financial success, which is then exponentially magnified again in New York.

[Clutch]

hmm....use everything to recruit lebron...BUT BASKETBALL ITSELF?

 

go ahead bron...make your money and get your lights...because thats all they've got to offer

[Newman]

I don't think getting a billionaire + numerous celebrities would affect LeBron's decision. One exception would be maybe Jay-Z but even he will have little influence over the final decision. I agree with Clutch and I think that basketball factors would be the most important ones in LeBron's mind.