Death Penalty Views

[Poe]

Shut up. You said you wanted to "help" these criminals. Therapy? Last time I checked people that go to therapy are patients. Medicine to control urges? Still patients. Please [expletive]ing explain to me how you plan on helping these people.

 

Hmm.. "criminal" is such an odd label. In the early 1900s, alcohol was illegal. If you drank or sold it, you were a criminal. I think around 1933 it became legalized. Let's say you drink alcohol the day before it became legal, you are a criminal. The next day, you are no longer so. So basically, you're only a "criminal" if the law decides you are. Society works in such strange ways.

 

 

Anyway, sure, sometimes therapy can help. It sure helped Ron Artest a great deal. Had he been given therapy after that violent act in Detroit instead of suspension, maybe the issue would have been solved faster.

 

See, Ron Artest wasn't a bad guy. Actually, people are only "bad" if you decide they are, but that's a different argument. If you know him in person, or watch his interviews or when he guests in shows, you know he's an outgoing guy that just wants to have fun, and he's a hard working basketball player as well. He slips up once, and boom! He's a criminal.

 

 

So perhaps in a way, Ron Artest was sick, if you want to call it that. People's brains work differently, and some people have very intense impulses where their emotions control them. Instead of locking these people up, the best thing to do is to either give them medication, have them do certain exercises like meditation, have them do neuro-feedback and manually train their brains to function more calmly, or have them do some therapy... or all of the above.

 

 

Of course, not every "criminal" has the same issue or has the same way to solve them. What I'm trying to say is, there are solutions to these issues. Locking people up or even giving them a death is an easy way out, and a very simple minded idea.

 

Anyway, if you want more reasons against the death penalty, this is a great video to watch: http://www.megavideo.com/?v=2XF4C9YK Don't worry, Penn and Teller are pretty entertaining.

[JYD]

Every system has its flaws. However, most of the time the guy is guilty.

One time is too many. If one of your buddies was wrongfully convicted, and you know it, but they gave him the death penalty, and then found out he was the wrong person, how would you feel? Come on man, you gotta put yourself in tehse other people's positions. If someone's not guilty, they're not guilty. I'm not saying this happens a lot, because it obviously doesn't. What I am saying is, that one time is still way too many. If someone sits in a cell for 20 years, sure that's 20 years they could've been enjoying their lives...but to kill someone and make a mistake? They aren't ever coming back.

[Guru]

Hmm.. "criminal" is such an odd label. In the early 1900s, alcohol was illegal. If you drank or sold it, you were a criminal. I think around 1933 it became legalized. Let's say you drink alcohol the day before it became legal, you are a criminal. The next day, you are no longer so. So basically, you're only a "criminal" if the law decides you are. Society works in such strange ways.

 

 

Anyway, sure, sometimes therapy can help. It sure helped Ron Artest a great deal. Had he been given therapy after that violent act in Detroit instead of suspension, maybe the issue would have been solved faster.

 

See, Ron Artest wasn't a bad guy. Actually, people are only "bad" if you decide they are, but that's a different argument. If you know him in person, or watch his interviews or when he guests in shows, you know he's an outgoing guy that just wants to have fun, and he's a hard working basketball player as well. He slips up once, and boom! He's a criminal.

 

 

So perhaps in a way, Ron Artest was sick, if you want to call it that. People's brains work differently, and some people have very intense impulses where their emotions control them. Instead of locking these people up, the best thing to do is to either give them medication, have them do certain exercises like meditation, have them do neuro-feedback and manually train their brains to function more calmly, or have them do some therapy... or all of the above.

 

 

Of course, not every "criminal" has the same issue or has the same way to solve them. What I'm trying to say is, there are solutions to these issues. Locking people up or even giving them a death is an easy way out, and a very simple minded idea.

 

Anyway, if you want more reasons against the death penalty, this is a great video to watch: http://www.megavideo.com/?v=2XF4C9YK Don't worry, Penn and Teller are pretty entertaining.

There are always two sides to an argument. Read C.S. Lewis "The Humanitarian Theory of Punishment". Although, I do not agree with some of his views he brings up some very good points that people seem to overlook all the time.

[Dash]

I have an uncle that has been in and out of jail numerous times, and I also know of a high school classmate that is currently in prison. My uncle talks about how he would rather live in jail right now, how you get to work and make money, get an education, and basically live for free. The guy that I went to school with, he's in prison for murdering a girl, and apparently, he has been telling his friends you can do more with your life in prison than you can living on your own outside of it.

 

So I recommend doing something else. Death penalty? I really don't care. Do something, though...just don't let them enjoy the rest of their lives in prison.

 

[expletive]ing this.It makes me sick to my stomach knowing that murders are getting a free ride over there.

Edited September 19, 2010 by Dash

[Flash]

We have laws for a reason. Some have tougher penalties than others because of the severity of those crimes.

 

See, Ron Artest wasn't a bad guy. Actually, people are only "bad" if you decide they are, but that's a different argument. If you know him in person, or watch his interviews or when he guests in shows, you know he's an outgoing guy that just wants to have fun, and he's a hard working basketball player as well. He slips up once, and boom! He's a criminal.

 

Ron Artest is still crazy. Back in Detroit he was provoked by idiot fans in Detroit and defended himself. IIRC he was never charged with anything or if he was I'm sure they were dropped.

 

Its time to stop making excuses for people who kill like the story posted by the OP and start holding them accountable for what they do.

[trutrojan8]

One time is too many. If one of your buddies was wrongfully convicted, and you know it, but they gave him the death penalty, and then found out he was the wrong person, how would you feel? Come on man, you gotta put yourself in tehse other people's positions. If someone's not guilty, they're not guilty. I'm not saying this happens a lot, because it obviously doesn't. What I am saying is, that one time is still way too many. If someone sits in a cell for 20 years, sure that's 20 years they could've been enjoying their lives...but to kill someone and make a mistake? They aren't ever coming back.

But how often has that ever happened? I don't think you can name an example..

[JYD]

But how often has that ever happened? I don't think you can name an example..

didn't i just state it rarely happens? but even to happen once or twice is too many man. what if you knew that person? a close friend? relative? being on death row for something they didn't do? come on, lets use logic here. that's some mother [expletive]ing bull[expletive].

 

http://www.innocenceproject.org/understand/Government-Misconduct.php?gclid=CM_XquOElaQCFYXs7QodqRD-AA

 

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/innocence-and-death-penalty

 

Interesting links I found.

 

"Since 1973, 138 people in 26 states have been released from death row with evidence of their innocence."

[deestillballin]

I think its too easy of a punishment. IMO.

 

Easy way out, no justice at all.

[Flash]

I think its too easy of a punishment. IMO.

 

Easy way out, no justice at all.

 

You'd rather waste your money keeping them in jail?

[Real Deal]

Poe, the only thing wrong with what you were saying is that Ron Artest wasn't charged with murder.

 

Would I be opposed to helping a criminal, as in a drug dealer? Nah. Put him in a rehab program...no big deal. See if you can help change his life.

 

Opposed to helping a child molester? Yeah. They can rot in prison.

 

Opposed to helping a murderer? Yeah. Take a life, lose yours. That's where the death penalty comes in.

[Poe]

Opposed to helping a murderer? Yeah. Take a life, lose yours. That's where the death penalty comes in.

 

 

So you believe in the "an eye for an eye" principle?

[deestillballin]

You'd rather waste your money keeping them in jail?

 

 

Im not saying that, but even you know that death is just the cowards way out, am I for it, yes but at hand its an easy way out, I'd much rather have a torture chamber than a death chamber. Its just too much of an easy way out.

[Flash]

So you believe in the "an eye for an eye" principle?

 

First degree murder of multiple people...hell yeah.

[Real Deal]

So you believe in the "an eye for an eye" principle?

If it's between the death penalty and trying to help them with medication and therapy and releasing them back into my world? Most definitely.

[Poe]

If it's between the death penalty and trying to help them with medication and therapy and releasing them back into my world? Most definitely.

 

Of course there would be necessary safety precautions to ensure that the convicted murderer wouldn't harm anyone else. Overall, every human life should be valued.

 

 

But if the eye for an eye works for the death of a single human being, then it must work for the masses as well. Both small cases and the extreme. If we are to truly uphold to this principal, then I think the world should agree that a couple atomic bombs needs to be dropped in the US. It's about 65 years overdue. An eye for an eye, a life for a life, a city for a city..... right?

[Real Deal]

Of course there would be necessary safety precautions to ensure that the convicted murderer wouldn't harm anyone else. Overall, every human life should be valued.

Contrary to what you believe, you aren't going to "cure" all murderers with meds and therapy sessions. If you want an example of how bad of an idea that is, look no further than Charles Manson, who received plenty of that and, to this day, wants to kill as much as he did the day he was thrown in the cell.

 

You know what Manson would do if he knew he could go through therapy and get out? Fake that desire. Hold back for months or years to lose 10-20 times as much off of his sentence.

 

But if the eye for an eye works for the death of a single human being, then it must work for the masses as well. Both small cases and the extreme. If we are to truly uphold to this principal, then I think the world should agree that a couple atomic bombs needs to be dropped in the US. It's about 65 years overdue. An eye for an eye, a life for a life, a city for a city..... right?

Nope. Instead, we should all get medical help, according to you.

 

I had no part in dropping that bomb. You execute the guilty murderers. There's no reason to try and twist that.

 

And before you say, "But they were all innocent lives lost...eye for an eye," that's what happens when a single murderer kills someone. McVeigh killed people. I didn't get put in prison for it.

[Poe]

Contrary to what you believe, you aren't going to "cure" all murderers with meds and therapy sessions. If you want an example of how bad of an idea that is, look no further than Charles Manson, who received plenty of that and, to this day, wants to kill as much as he did the day he was thrown in the cell.

 

You know what Manson would do if he knew he could go through therapy and get out? Fake that desire. Hold back for months or years to lose 10-20 times as much off of his sentence.

 

I'm not sure what you are replying to, but the post you quoted said that it would be wise to take necessary precautions to ensure that the person doesn't kill again.

 

 

I had no part in dropping that bomb. You execute the guilty murderers. There's no reason to try and twist that.

 

Fine, are we still at war? Let's go execute Obama, and Bush too, and all the soldiers who took part in any killings of middle easterners.

[EastCoastNiner]

Wow.....is he really trying to say that there should be "eye for an eye" since we dropped an atomic bomb on a country that attacked us first, and killed many people?

 

Pretty much you're saying that as long as you're the first person to commit the deadly crime, you don't have to worry about being hurt if it was your call.

 

You're making absolutely no sense trying to compare the dropping of the atomic bombs and fighting in the Middle East which we were provoked by to little petty things. You're being quite ridiculous.

 

You know something is wrong when you even have the tree-huggers like lkr opposing your views........

Edited September 21, 2010 by EastCoastNiner

[Poe]

You know something is wrong when you even have the tree-huggers like lkr opposing your views........

 

A lot of good ideas are unpopular. Let's free the slaves. Let's give women the right to vote. Let's not fight wars. Let's end religion.

 

 

Granted, lots of bad ideas are unpopular as well. Bottom line, popularity doesn't mean [expletive].

Edited September 21, 2010 by Poe

[Flash]

Let's free the slaves

 

It's not like they were freed because slavery was wrong.

[Guru]

A lot of good ideas are unpopular. Let's free the slaves. Let's give women the right to vote. Let's not fight wars. Let's end religion.

 

 

Granted, lots of bad ideas are unpopular as well. Bottom line, popularity doesn't mean [expletive].

You are comparing criminals to regular people. Remember we are talking about the death penalty here; to get sentenced to death you didn't simply steal a car or commit check fraud. I see your point about good idea's being unpopular, but I'm not convinced that this is a good idea.

[Flash]

Its not a good idea because it's going to lead to overpopulated jails and wasted tax payer dollars to keep these facilities in tact and for what? So some headcase can pretend like he's getting treatment? Its a ridiculous idea and that right there is the easy way out, not death.

[Real Deal]

I'm not sure what you are replying to, but the post you quoted said that it would be wise to take necessary precautions to ensure that the person doesn't kill again.

That was clear as day, just like me saying "necessary precautions" doesn't work on everyone. You wouldn't mind releasing murderers as long as they go through some therapy sessions and take their meds. Unfortunately, you're one of the few that doesn't mind.

 

Fine, are we still at war? Let's go execute Obama, and Bush too, and all the soldiers who took part in any killings of middle easterners.

Right, because killing terrorists should be viewed the same way as killing an innocent 10-year old boy. We're all human!

[Flash]

In the real world, people aren't always good people. I think that's what Poe is failing to understand here. In reality, not everyone wants to be a decent person and they don't care what they do. Putting them in some facility to "treat" them isn't going to accomplish anything. It'll actually make things worse because then they know they aren't going to be held accountable for what they did. They're just going to live off your hard earned money to eat [expletive] and pretend like they're changing.

[YugoRocketsFan]

A lot of good ideas are unpopular. Let's free the slaves. Let's give women the right to vote. Let's not fight wars. Let's end religion.

 

 

Granted, lots of bad ideas are unpopular as well. Bottom line, popularity doesn't mean [expletive].

 

Im gonna say it again, you're a huge liberall.