Raptors Tanking/Draft Anticipation

[AboveLegit]

I've heard that Barnes has enrolled in summer classes, and many are saying that it almost guarantees that he will remain in school. Sucks to hear, I hope he does prove everyone wrong.

[Buckets!]

Raptors locked up the third worst record with their loss to the Heat, which gives them a 15.6% chance to win the lottery. Worst case scenario, they fall to 6th. Hopefully Barnes proves all the "experts" wrong and declares because at least that way the Raptors would likely walk away with one of Irving, Barnes, Williams, Kanter or Valanciunas, assuming that they at least stay in the top 5 which I think is a reasonable assumption.

 

Either way, May 17th can't come any sooner.

I thought the draft was in June.

[Built Ford Tough]

I've heard that Barnes has enrolled in summer classes, and many are saying that it almost guarantees that he will remain in school. Sucks to hear, I hope he does prove everyone wrong.

 

I do think he will go back, but enrolling in summer classes doesn't mean he has to go back. Bayless has been/was taking summer classes at Arizona ever since he was drafted as he promised his parents (both are lawyers or something highly educated like that) that he would get his degree even though he left for the NBA after his freshman season.

 

I do think that Barnes is definitely staying, though. A poor decision on his part if you ask me, but it sounds like that is what he will be doing.

 

I thought the draft was in June.

 

It is, but the lottery is May 17th. The lottery this year is probably more important than the draft itself as the Raptors board is probably already pretty much set based on where they are picking.

 

1st = Irving

2nd = Williams/Barnes (Irving if a team like Washington wins)

3rd = Barnes/Williams

4th = Kanter

5th = Valanciunas

 

Assuming Barnes doesn't declare, just slide Kanter and Valanciunas up a spot each.

 

Obviously they might fall in love with somebody during workouts or something like that, but I think this year their pick is pretty much made for them based on where they are sitting after the lottery considering the complete lack of depth drastically limits their options.

[Built Ford Tough]

From Ford's latest entry detailing who he thinks each team will pick should they win the lottery as well as who he thinks they will pick should they stand pat at their respective draft positions.

 

The Cavs weren't the only team to see their fortunes sink with the loss of a big-time free agent. Chris Bosh's departure had a devastating effect on the team as well. The Raptors do have a lot of young talent at their disposal, but for the most part the team hasn't jelled. Their biggest long-term needs are at the point and small forward position. They also could use a center that's willing to rebound. Irving is the most likely choice if they get the top pick, but Barnes and Williams would be good fits at small forward. The team has also been high on Enes Kanter and Lithuania's Jonas Valanciunas, two European big men who can rebound the ball.

 

In somewhat related news, the pick that the Raptors traded to Chicago for James Johnson is officially 28th overall. Looking back on that trade now after seeing Johnson play for 20 or so games, that was definitely a great move by Colangelo considering how weak this draft is. I liked the trade when it happened and love it now.

[Buckets!]

BARNES IS STAYING, NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

 

I don't want Irving so I guess it's Derrik Williams.

[Built Ford Tough]

A source told me that Enes Kanter will not work out for any NBA teams until after the draft lottery, which takes place May 17. NBA teams have requested to watch Enes Kanter work out at ATTACK Athletics in Chicago, but no teams have been allowed in to watch him play. Kanter likely will not work out head-to-head with any players between now and the NBA Draft.

 

http://www.thehoopsreport.com/article.aspx?id=710

 

Kanter is probably who I would like to see the Raptors pick at 3 should they not move up or down in the lottery, but all of this dodgning competition is starting to worry me. I can understand not working out against other top draft prospects because a lot of the players projected to go in the top 5 do this, but him refusing to participate in the Hoops Summit and not going out and signing with a Euroleague club or something like that after it was clear that he wouldn't be ruled eligble for the NCAA is a bit worrisome if you ask me. If there is a lockout next season it will literally have been 2 years (or a year and a half if half the season is lost) since he has played in any real competitive basketball.

 

The thing that gets me the most is that he sounds like he might try and dictate where he is going to be drafted as well. I heard something about how he may not work out at all for specific teams and if he tries to dictate where he is drafted like Rubio did a few years ago, I would just say screw it and not draft the guy. If a player is 18 years old and already trying to dictate where he plays, you know the guy probably isn't going to be very loyal and there is a very good chance that he just bounces at the first opportunity to go to a bigger market.

[Built Ford Tough]

A nice little article on the 4 main International prospects (Kanter, Valanciunas, Vesely and Biyombo).

 

Kanter scored a Nike Hoop Summit-record 33 points and pulled down 14 rebounds in the 2010 game in Portland against a Team USA front line that included Ohio State’s Jared Sullinger, Florida’s Patric Young, Kentucky’s Terrence Jones and North Carolina’s Harrison Barnes.

 

According to ESPN.com’s Fran Fraschilla, if the 19-year-old Kanter had played college basketball this year, he would have had the same impact on Kentucky that Sullinger did with the Buckeyes.

 

Fraschilla said Kanter invites contact around the basket, has good footwork and has a nice shooting touch out to the college 3-point line.

 

The consensus is that Kanter isn’t a superior athlete and that he might not have a lot of upside. Habbas said Kanter will play center in the NBA.

 

“He’s a good rebounder, but not a great one,” he said.

 

Habbas agrees that Kanter is the most ready to play — if he’s near his playing shape of 255 pounds.

 

“If he’s in shape, he’ll be the most impactful (international player),” he said.

 

Fraschilla reports that Kanter is currently working out in Chicago with famed NBA skills guru Tim Grover.

 

He’s a player on the Cavs’ radar if they land the No. 2 or 3 pick in the draft.

 

He reminds scouts of: Al Jefferson

 

Jan Vesely, Czech Republic, power forward, 6-11, 240: He’s one of the best athletes in the draft. Fraschilla predicted he would win an NBA dunk contest someday.

 

Some seem to think he can play small forward in the NBA, which might be a stretch. He has a good motor, runs the floor well and moves great without the ball.

 

Habbas said Vesely is a “stretch 4.”

 

“He has a good set 3-point shot,” Habbas said. “His biggest skill is his ability to stretch the floor. He has a combination of athleticism, rebounding and hustle.”

 

He reminds scouts of: Andre Kirilenko.

 

 

Bismack Biyombo, Congo, power forward, 6-9, 243: Fraschilla guarantees that no more than three teams even knew who this guy was before January. Now, he’s going to be a lottery pick.

 

Defensively, he could be a force early on in the NBA because of his 7-7 wingspan, strength and athleticism. He burst upon the scene in last month’s Hoop Summit with a triple-double.

 

But as good as he could be defensively, he’s just as raw offensively. That’s why scouts don’t compare him to fellow countryman Serge Ibaka, who can make a mid-range jump shot.

 

“The issue I have is whether he can catch the ball,” Habbas said. “He doesn’t have the greatest hands. I don’t like the Ibaka comparison. It’s more like Ben Wallace when he first came to the league.”

 

Habbas said he’s seen Biyombo ranked as high as No. 3 on some draft boards.

 

“I’m vehemently against that,” he said. “But he’ll likely go in the top 10.”

 

He reminds scouts of: Ben Wallace.

 

Jonas Valanciunas, Lithuania, forward/center, 6-11, 230: Scouts are raving about his potential. But he’s probably the least ready of the international prospects scheduled to be drafted in the lottery.

 

“In this draft, I like him the most,” Habbas said. “He has the potential to do everything. But he doesn’t do anything great. He does outwork everyone.

 

“He needs to spend one or two more years in Europe.”

 

Valanciunas turned 19 on Friday. Fraschilla said his size, agility and athleticism make him very enticing for a team willing to wait for him to physically mature. Would that be enough for a team like the Cavs to bypass him in the draft?

 

They need immediate help, something he won’t be able to provide. On the other hand, they’re not going to be real good next year and might be able to wait for Valanciunas to mature.

 

ESPN.com’s Chad Ford has the Cavs taking Valanciunas with the eighth pick in his latest mock draft.

 

He reminds scouts of: Andris Biedrins.

 

http://morningjournal.com/articles/2011/05/07/sports/doc4dc60355598e6225442799.txt?viewmode=default

 

Kanter is probably my number one choice (after Irving and Williams, assuming he can play the 3 adequately) but I don't think that I would be too against taking a chance on a guy like Valanciunas, even though he is a huge project and has a good chance of being a bust. Biyombo scares me simply because up until a month and a half ago, he was probably not evern a first round pick and guys with his meteroic rise seem to always wind up being huge busts, but he definitely has intriguing defensive potential, despite being relatively small for the center position in the NBA (although he makes up for it with a ridiculous 7'7 wingspan). I don't really want any part of Vesely as it is looking more and more like he is not a small forward like people originally though. If he is just another athletic 4, I hope the Raptors stay away from him considering Ed Davis and Amir Johnson, both of which I think are better than Vesely is likely to be.

 

PS: Exactly one week until the lottery. I doubt the Raptors move in the draft, but I just pray that they don't fall too far down because moving down to 6 would be absolutely awful.

Edited May 10, 2011 by Built Ford Tough

[Built Ford Tough]

Video of Kanter working out with Tim Grover.

 

 

He is my 3rd choice without a doubt now behind Irving and Williams (who I am still hesitant on until he proves he can without a doubt play the 3). He just looks like he is too skilled to pass up in a draft that is lacking in skilled players. If he measures out to be a legit 6'11 like he looks, I would definitely have no problem with the Raptors drafting him at 3, or even 2 assuming Irving is off the board.

 

Some stuff from Ford as well.

 

chadfordinsider Chad Ford

Kanter looked great. Tough. Great shooter. Skilled. Showed some leaping ability. In great shape. Feeling good about our Top 3 projection.

 

Here's his new top 10:

 

http://espn.go.com/nba/draft

 

1. Irving

2. Williams

3. Kanter

4. Knight

5. Leonard

6. Walker

7. Vesely

8. Biyombo

9. Thompson

10. Valanciunas

Edited May 12, 2011 by Built Ford Tough

[Dash]

Only way Kanter isn't top 3 would be because of his knees but this draft is so weak that the Raptors or another would take the risk.

 

If Jonas Valanciunas continues to drop he may be in Rockets range.

[Check my Stats]

I had no idea Kanter had a jumper like that. If we take him, Bargnani better be gone, and he better be able to play C. It still burns my ass that Barnes backed out, [expletive]

Edited May 12, 2011 by Check my Stats

[Built Ford Tough]

Same more Kanter stuff, as he is my latest flavour of the week prospect:

 

Interview with Chad Ford:

 

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=6540086

 

Kanter was allowed to practice this season with Kentucky, however, and NBA scouts were allowed to attend many of the workouts. Many days, Kanter worked out against senior Josh Harrelson, another top center prospect. That has alleviated the concerns of a few teams.

 

"Me personally, I wouldn't be concerned," said a Pacific division exec. "Most of the people who have done their homework have been able to see him in person. I did. Anybody who thought they may have been interested should have been there. I bet you anybody in the top five was in those practices more than once. And (Kentucky coach John) Calipari practices most of the time. He went against Harrelson. But you could have seen him go against Vanderbilt or Florida and you might not see him go up against a guy better than Harrelson. Sometimes there's a roadblock that says, 'We shouldn't draft this guy.' There's none of that here."

 

Talk about Washington drafting Kanter over Williams should they win the lottery tomorrow:

 

a source told ESPN's Chad Ford that the Wizards would seriously consider taking Enes Kanter over Williams if they won the lottery.

 

http://dc.sbnation.com/washington-wizards/2011/5/16/2174145/enes-kanter-wizards-nba-draft-lottery

 

 

 

Also, Colangelo pretty much calls this draft a two prospect draft, but who knows if that is what he is really thinking or if he is just blowing smoke up everybodies asses like he usually does.

 

Colangelo considers Duke freshman point guard Kyrie Irving and Arizona sophomore forward Derrick Williams the top prospects available, but said the rest of the draft holds a lot of “murkiness.”

 

“Every team will probably look at it a little bit differently,” Colangelo said. “Once the results of the lottery are known we will have a more clearer idea of what’s going on up there. If Washington wins the lottery, it’s pretty clear that they probably don’t require a point guard – and if someone really wants a point guard they will probably make an attempt to make some type of a deal with Washington. That might go for a couple of teams as well.”

 

http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AprOMfCVjUjNUqEBoF3BUG5ShgM6?slug=mc-spears_weak_2011_nba_draft_awaits_lottery_051611

[Built Ford Tough]

[expletive] the draft now, for all I care.

 

I can't believe the light at the end of the tunnel that was this miserable season is going to be Kemba Walker or Brandon Knight.

 

All I asked was that the Raptors don't fall out of the top 3 and of course the worst case scenario unfolds and they go down to 5 (there literally is no difference between 5 and 6 as far as I am concerned).

[BasX]

BPA.. cause what is this i don't even

[Built Ford Tough]

BPA.. cause what is this i don't even

 

Screw BPA, go BCPA.

 

Best Canadian Player Available (in other words, Tristan Thompson).

 

Then buy a late 1st or 2nd and draft Corey Joseph, pick up Myck Kabongo next season and hope that Andrew Wiggins continues to develop and turns into the beast that he can be. Oh yeah, pick up Khem Birch somewhere in this as well.

 

Throw out a lineup of:

 

Khem Birch

Tristan Thompson

Andrew Wiggins

Corey Joseph

Myck Kabongo

 

They will suck, but every game would be sold out and would make MLSE a lot of money, which is all they really care about anyways.

Edited May 18, 2011 by Built Ford Tough

[Dash]

Just get Jonas Valanciunas, he probably won't come over this season but the rest of the shit in this draft is so much worse.

[BasX]

The Corey Joseph stuff is interesting because I heard he came out because a team (apparently the Cavaliers) said they'd take him in the second round. Essentially BC should take a chance on him for Canadian interest.

[Built Ford Tough]

From Paul Jones

Paul__Jones Paul Jones

Colangelo: there are a handful of guys we like (K. Walker, B. Knight. B. Biyombo, E. Kanter, K. Leonard, A. Burks, J. Valacnciunas)

 

Gotta love Jonsey's spelling of "Valanciunas".

[Built Ford Tough]

Some stuff from the combine that I have read around various sites. I will probably watch a bit of it when it airs on NBATV Canada in 2 hours, so I may add some more later, although I doubt I watch much of it as it is uaully a waste of time.

 

"At number 5 we have 2 point guards that will still be there that we're very interested in Kemba and Knight."

 

No real shock here as Colangelo has mentioned Kemba and Knight before, and he spent about 3 scouting trips to UCONN to watch Walker play.

 

He mentioned something along the lines of not caring if they get an impact player right off the bat and is perfectly fine with taking a guy who may take a few years to make an impact as the team is still in the midst of a rebuilding process. Maybe a sign that he would take Knight over Walker if both of them are still on the board at 5 considering Knight is considered to have the higher ceiling? Maybe a sign that he is seriously considering one of the high risk, high reward International players such as Valanciunas or Biyombo?

 

 

 

It isn't official yet, but a lot of people are saying that Walker measured just around 5'11 3/4 without shoes one, which would make him pretty much the same size as a guy like Chris Paul and would mean that he is probably about 6'1-6'2 with shoes on. If this turns out to be true, he is a lot taller than I thought he was as I was expecting about 5'11 with shoes. HIm not being extremely undersized at the point guard spot makes me a lot more interested in him, again, assuming this is true. I think he is going to have very impressive athletic testing results as well.

 

With that said, I still am not huge on either one of Knight or Walker as I still don't think either one is really much of an upgrade as a prospect over Bayless.

 

 

 

Enes Kanter was apperantly impressing everybody who watched him as well.

 

chadfordinsider Chad Ford

Enes Kanter impressed GMs here. Looked more athletic than they thought. Marshon Brooks looked great too. Ditto Kenneth Faried.

 

http://twitter.com/#!/chadfordinsider/status/71281554055372802

 

Unfortunately, I highly doubt he falls to 5. I think the absolute latest he gets drafted would be at 4 as I don't see Cleveland passing on him. Him and Irving would be a great duo to come away from this draft with. The only way I see him falling past 4 is if the Cavs really like one of Walker or Knight and they decide to go with Williams first instead of Irving.

 

I just wish that the Raptors didn't fall to 5 as it basically eliminated him from contention for them. Even falling to 4 would've been fine with me as I still think that they would've had a real shot at landing him at 4. Oh well.

 

 

 

Kind of irrelevenat to us, but Williams continues to mention that he is a small forward at every possible moment..

 

DraftExpress Jonathan Givony

Derrick Williams was emphatic about the fact that he is a small forward in the interviews today. Repeated it over and over again.

 

 

Some speculation from Ryan Wolstat on trading up for number 2. Nothing more than speculation, though.

 

WolstatSun Ryan Wolstat

Just thinking out loud here, but Minny has some brutal contracts. Wonder if they'd do pick 2 for 5 swap if Raptors took 2 of them

 

WolstatSun Ryan Wolstat

BC would have to think about a Derrick Williams + Ridnour + Pekovic for Bargnani + No. 5 deal I would think.

 

 

Just in case anybody wants to know, Tristan Thompson supposedly measured out at 6'9 with shoes. He mentioned that he thinks he would be a great fit next to Greg Monroe and seems to want to go to Detroit, but it was a Pistons writer who was interviewing him at the time, so it could just be him being politically correct.

[Built Ford Tough]

TheHoopsReport Ryan Feldman

 

Brandon Knight went out to dinner with the Toronto Raptors. I hear they have a lot of interest in Knight at 5.

 

nbadraftnet NBADraft.net

Kemba Walker measured 6'1 in shoes according to a source in CHI. That's huge for his draft stock.

 

I think the Raptors pick will inevitably be one of these two, depending on which one is still available at 5 (I think the Jazz will take one of them at 3). Based on what Colangelo has said about being interested in players who are preceived as raw and not worried about getting an immediate impact player, it makes me think he is leaning more towards Knight over Walker, but unless something unexpected happens, I think the Raptors will walk away from the draft with one of these two players.

[Built Ford Tough]

So supposedly Kanter denied interview with three teams and of course, Toronto was one of them. He also blew off the Bucks and the Jazz as well.

 

I like his skill set and all, but he seems like he is trying to dictate where he gets drafted with him denying interviews and workouts with specific teams and mentioning constantly how he wants to be drafted by the Wizards.

 

DX has all of the measurements up as well.

 

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?page=&year=2011&source=All&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&sort=

 

None of the athletic testing for any of the guys who the Raptors are likely to pick are up. I'm not sure if that is because guys like Knight and Walker didn't participate in any of it or it they did and it will just be updated later.

 

They do have Walker and Knight's height, weight, wingspan etc... up, though.

[Dash]

I don't understand why Kanter blew off the Raptors, it would take Cleveland to pass up on him but Toronto is a plausible destination.

 

FWIW Draftexpress has Kanter going 8th.

[AboveLegit]

So with Enes blowing off the Raps, there's absolutely no chance they draft him, right?

[Check my Stats]

So with Enes blowing off the Raps, there's absolutely no chance they draft him, right?

 

Hopefully not. I doubt he'll be there, but you take the BPA. He probably saw our front court situation (2 guys locked in long term in Andrea and Amir, then Ed Davis being a key cog on our team) and didn't want to go there. I'm sure he'd be fine as long as he got assurances of playing time and shit.

 

Though this is just me hoping probably lol.

 

I really don't care anymore though, I will be fine with any of Kemba/Kanter/Knight... I want no part of the euros or that Biyombo guy.

[Built Ford Tough]

So with Enes blowing off the Raps, there's absolutely no chance they draft him, right?

 

They would draft him if they thought he was the BPA. Colangelo didn't workout Ed Davis and I believe he only spoke with him one time last season prior to the draft (to tell him that if he falls to 13 the Raptors will take him) but had no problems drafting him. They may have interviewed him at the Combine, I'm not 100% sure, but I know for a fact that they never worked him out or anything like that prior to drafting him.

 

If Colangelo thinks that Kanter is the best pick for the team (assuming he is available) I am certain that he will draft him.

 

Besides, this whole thing was basically a huge misunderstanding by the sounds of things. The Raptors, like the Jazz, will be heading to Chicago to watch Kanter workout with Grover.

 

Yet the talk surrounding Kanter in Chicago had much more to do with the fact that he didn't sit down for interviews with Utah (No. 3, No. 12 picks), Toronto (No. 5) and Milwaukee (No. 10). Those non-meetings raised questions about whether Kanter's camp was avoiding certain teams, but Ergul said that wasn't entirely the case. They were only avoiding the Bucks.

 

"The only one I really didn't care for him [to go to] is Milwaukee," Ergul said. "I'll be honest ... it came out all wrong. [utah general manager] Kevin [O'Connor] knew about it ... We called them, and it was because in next two weeks I had a feeling we were going to see each other extensively, so there's no reason for that [interview].

 

"Utah is coming here to Chicago, and we're going to go to Minnesota in the second half of June," Ergul said. "Toronto is coming here. Cleveland (Nos. 1 and 4 picks), we're trying to discussing logistics of dates and stuff."

 

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/sam_amick/05/23/predraft.camp.wrap/

 

So I don't think it was as bad as it first seemed. Just some miscommunication between the two parties.

 

Gotta love the part about the Bucks, though.

 

"We are not avoiding anybody........ well maybe the Bucks".

 

 

I really don't care anymore though, I will be fine with any of Kemba/Kanter/Knight... I want no part of the euros or that Biyombo guy.

 

I'd be fine with Valanciunas considering his potential on both ends of the floor and him being more skilled than I originally thought. Vesely and Biyombo scare me, though.

 

Kanter scares me somewhat. He has the talent, size and rebounding ability, but hearing how Len Elmore talk about how he was getting destroyed on the defensive end and being targeted by opposing players during the two-on-two drills it makes me a bit weary of him. I wouldn't complain if they draft him, but I can definitely see him being a borderline liability on the defensive end of the floor.

 

So long as the Raptors come away from this draft with one of Knight, Kanter, Valanciunas or Walker I will be happy, though. Considering the fact that the Raptors are guaranteed to land one of them I will probably be happy with the outcome. I think that these 4 are probably at the top of the Raptors board, with Walker trailing behind the other three by a bit.

[AboveLegit]

BFT, isn't Knight and Bayless too redundant though? I'd assume that at the top of the Raps draft board, they have the two bigs (Kanter and Val).

 

And I also think they should look at trading down if they're not comfortable with selecting any of the prospects left on the board in order to get a guy like Kawhi Leonard. They need some help on the defensive end and with rebounding. There's a ton of big men they can select next year (although, the same could be said about the crop of SF's in 2012 too).