Kobe wants Gasol to be more aggressive

[*Swish*]

http://www.realgm.com/images/nba/4.2/wiretap/photos/2006/Gasol_Pau_lal_091119.jpg

 

Pau Gasol has gone through a rough stretch recently, returning to playing with a softness that drew criticism in the 2008 playoffs.

 

"Even when he was in Memphis and he was the go-to guy, he was always very nice," Kobe Bryant said of Gasol. "Very white swan. I need him to be black swan. Be an (expletive) sometimes."

 

"It definitely had a very positive effect on me that he approached me," Gasol said. "He let me know, 'Look, it starts with us. And I'll go, but you've got to go, too.' "

 

Bryant and Gasol have a closer emotional relationship than the shooting guard had with former teammate Shaquille O'Neal.

 

"Every time we communicate, it has a very good effect," Gasol said. "So that means we both are tuned in and we both try to get on the same page."

 

 

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/210537/Kobe_Needs_Gasol_To_Be_Black_Swan

 

Totally agree with Kobe. Pau Gasol NEEDS to be more aggressive especially if they want to make run to have the home court advantage and get the #1 spot in the West. It's good to know that Gasol and Kobe have a good relation so Bryant could tell him everything that he thinks about him etc. Hope Gasol will listen and start by being aggressive when the Spurs game come by on Thursday night

[Sħãlïq™]

I hate GaSOFT, man... He needs to go really. How many more games need LAL to lose..?!

[Lkr]

I hate GaSOFT, man... He needs to go really. How many more games need LAL to lose..?!

How many more titles does he have to win to prove himself to you? Lakers went from 8th seed to 3 straight Finals appearances with two wins.

 

BTW, the 'White Swan' comment made me laugh

[Hawks Fly High]

I hate GaSOFT, man... He needs to go really. How many more games need LAL to lose..?!

It's disgusting how underrated Pau Gasol is for LA. Everyone goes through tough stretches. He came up huge in the Gasol-Garnett match up in the NBA finals last year.

[Sħãlïq™]

How many more titles does he have to win to prove himself to you? Lakers went from 8th seed to 3 straight Finals appearances with two wins.

WHAT?! He didn't win [expletive] by himself. And the Lakers lost the 08 title mainly 'cause of GaSOFT's SOFTNESS.... <_< Damn, I'm still mad at him 'cause of that wasted opportunity.... F#@$#$!@$@!!!! :angry: :angry:

http://images.zaazu.com/img/male16-male-mad-angry-smiley-emoticon-000099-facebook.gif

Edited February 3, 2011 by Shaliq

[Lkr]

no one said he did it by himself

[Sħãlïq™]

no one said he did it by himself

Didn't you ask "How many more titles does he have to win..."? The way you put it it sounds like he won them all by himself.

 

(Man, when's Bynum comin' back????)

Edited February 3, 2011 by Shaliq

[Real Deal]

Gasol is shooting 51.5% from the floor, his worst as a Laker (and a little low for someone who should be in the low post), and also shooting more shot attempts (13.7) than he has in all but TWO of his seasons in the NBA. And, he's not getting to the line...just 5.1 FTA per game for Gasol, the lowest of his career (because he's not aggressive).

 

Bryant is averaging 46.5% FG (second highest since 2002), under three turnovers a game (matching his career average), 25.6 PPG (higher than his career average), 5.0 RPG (nearly matching career average), 4.9 APG (above career average), and doing all of this in 33.5 minutes per game (lowest since he was an NBA sophomore, lowest as a starter).

 

Over the last three seasons, the Lakers have had a better record 48 games into the season...except for 2007-08. They started 31-17, and in those 48 games, they had Gasol for just ONE of them...and it was the same year we lost in the Finals to...the Celtics.

 

Easiest schedule in the NBA, and we're at 33-15 with Kobe and Gasol both playing? So this Lakers team has a similar start to the 2008 team that didn't even have Gasol? That's mind-blowing.

 

When everyone was talking about how Gasol was the best PF in the NBA, I continued to shake my head and think of how asinine that was. As we progress, it's becoming more clear.

 

By the numbers, Odom is the second best player on this team. He's FAR more efficient than Gasol is, pulling down more boards in 36 minutes per (he plays less than Pau), and he's doing whatever the team asks of him...whether it's posting up on Scola or taking him out to the perimeter and driving to the rim, or hitting a wide-open three.

 

Gasol helped us win two titles, in the same way Dirk, Duncan, Amare and a few other PF's would've. What does that have to do with this season? Ron Artest helped us out last season, by defending Pierce and Durant. This year? He's a mess.

 

It's Pau that didn't play for Spain, wanted to rest...and he's averaging the same amount of minutes he did over the last two seasons for Los Angeles. He needs to step it up and start playing like a big man again, instead of pretending to be someone he's not.

[Sħãlïq™]

Gasol is shooting 51.5% from the floor, his worst as a Laker (and a little low for someone who should be in the low post), and also shooting more shot attempts (13.7) than he has in all but TWO of his seasons in the NBA. And, he's not getting to the line...just 5.1 FTA per game for Gasol, the lowest of his career (because he's not aggressive).

 

Over the last three seasons, the Lakers have had a better record 48 games into the season...except for 2007-08. They started 31-17, and in those 48 games, they had Gasol for just ONE of them...and it was the same year we lost in the Finals to...the Celtics.

Easiest schedule in the NBA, and we're at 33-15 with Kobe and Gasol both playing? So this Lakers team has a similar start to the 2008 team that didn't even have Gasol? That's mind-blowing.

 

When everyone was talking about how Gasol was the best PF in the NBA, I continued to shake my head and think of how asinine that was. As we progress, it's becoming more clear.

 

By the numbers, Odom is the second best player on this team. He's FAR more efficient than Gasol is, pulling down more boards in 36 minutes per (he plays less than Pau), and he's doing whatever the team asks of him...whether it's posting up on Scola or taking him out to the perimeter and driving to the rim, or hitting a wide-open three.

 

Gasol helped us win two titles, in the same way Dirk, Duncan, Amare and a few other PF's would've. What does that have to do with this season? Ron Artest helped us out last season, by defending Pierce and Durant. This year? He's a mess.

Amen to that. Sadly, Mitch ain't got the balls to trade Gasol..... <_<

[Real Deal]

Amen to that. Sadly, Mitch ain't got the balls to trade Gasol..... <_>

I wouldn't trade him, but he just needs to step his game up and play the role he needs to play in the offense.

[The Truth]

if you look closely at Gasol's stats in last year's finals, you'll see that he deserved to be MVP of that series. I know Kobe homers will say I'm wrong, but I got my mind made up on this already. Pau was the Lakers' best player in the finals.

[Lemon]

if you look closely at Gasol's stats in last year's finals, you'll see that he deserved to be MVP of that series. I know Kobe homers will say I'm wrong, but I got my mind made up on this already. Pau was the Lakers' best player in the finals.

 

I'm sure the Kobe haters will all agree with you though. But that's beside the point. Pau is playing the most passive and possibly the worst basketball he's ever played since he's been a Laker. He has a lot of time to shake it off, but right now, that's how he's playing.

 

Last 3 games:

OT Win against Houston: Scola and Hayes combine for 9 OR, They average a combined 4.8.

Loss against Boston: 7 rebounds; Team is outrebounded by 13.

Loss against Sac: Cousins scores 27 on 19 (partially Drews fault).

[The Truth]

oh yeah, Pau's been horribly lately, but he's just going through a rough stretch - it happens to the best of them.

 

I just mentioned the finals because some people in here were acting like Pau was never that great. I forgot the exact numbers, but I remember he had like, more points, rebounds, blocks, and a higher shooting percentage than Kobe in the finals.

[Big Penny]

oh yeah, Pau's been horribly lately, but he's just going through a rough stretch - it happens to the best of them.

 

I just mentioned the finals because some people in here were acting like Pau was never that great. I forgot the exact numbers, but I remember he had like, more points, rebounds, blocks, and a higher shooting percentage than Kobe in the finals.

Of course Pau would have a higher FG%, more rebounds and more blocks lol. He's a 7 foot PF/C. If he didn't have more boards, blocks and a higher FG% then he would've played extremely bad.

 

http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=6608

 

Kobe had more points than Gasol, not even close. They both shot fairly badly actually. Kobe shot Although he took more shots to get there, which you would expect from the #1 option. Kobe shot 41% (46% for the season) and Gasol shot 48% (54% for the season)... but the whole team shoty poorly, so these descreased numbers are probably due to the Celtics defense.

 

Kobe averaged 10PPG more than Gasol, despite playing less minutes. And if you watch the games, you could tell that Kobe was more valuable to the Lakers than Gasol.

[Real Deal]

oh yeah, Pau's been horribly lately, but he's just going through a rough stretch - it happens to the best of them.

 

I just mentioned the finals because some people in here were acting like Pau was never that great. I forgot the exact numbers, but I remember he had like, more points, rebounds, blocks, and a higher shooting percentage than Kobe in the finals.

Haha, who told you he had more points? If you watched the series, you would've known Gasol didn't...so someone must have told you this stuff.

 

Gasol's games...

GM1: 23 PTS (8-14 FG, .571), 14 REB, 3 AST, 3 BLK

GM2: 25 PTS (7-10 FG, .700), 8 REB, 3 AST, 6 BLK

GM3: 13 PTS (5-11 FG, .455), 10 REB, 4 AST, 2 BLK

GM4: 21 PTS (6-13 FG, .462), 6 REB, 3 AST, 2 BLK

GM5: 12 PTS (5-12 FG, .417), 12 REB, 0 AST, 0 BLK

GM6: 17 PTS (6-14 FG, .429), 13 REB, 9 AST, 3 BLK

GM7: 19 PTS (6-16 FG, .375), 18 REB, 4 AST, 2 BLK

TOTAL: 18.6 PPG (43-90, .478), 11.6 RPG, 3.7 APG, 2.57 SPG

 

Kobe's games...

GM1: 30 PTS (10-22 FG, .455), 7 REB, 6 AST, 1 STL

GM2: 21 PTS (8-20 FG, .400), 5 REB, 6 AST, 4 STL

GM3: 29 PTS (10-29 FG, .345), 7 REB, 4 AST, 2 STL

GM4: 33 PTS (10-22 FG, .455), 6 REB, 2 AST, 2 STL

GM5: 38 PTS (13-27 FG, .481), 5 REB, 4 AST, 1 STL

GM6: 26 PTS (9-19 FG, .474), 11 REB, 3 AST, 4 STL

GM7: 23 PTS (6-24 FG, .250), 15 REB, 2 AST, 1 STL

TOTAL: 28.6 PPG (66-163, .405), 8 RPG, 3.9 APG, 2.14 SPG

 

Boston centered around defending Bryant, just like they did in 2008. Ray, Tony, Paul, Rajon...whoever they could throw at him, they did...and Garnett was not afraid to leave Odom (when Gasol was at center) to come over and stop Bryant from getting to the rim.

 

Gasol had a higher FG% than Kobe? Of course he did...he's a PF/C. Perkins shot 57% in the series...do you compare that to Ray Allen, or Paul Pierce's shooting? Michael Jordan shot around 41-42% in a couple of his Finals series as well (vs. Sonics and Jazz), but he won the MVP because he was the conductor. He ran the offense, he was the primary scorer, he defended very well, and he drew the doubles and created opportunities for the open man, and he was deserving of those Finals MVP awards.

 

Crunch the numbers all you want, but Kobe was, hands down, the Finals MVP. Gasol has never been a better player than Kobe, regular season or playoffs, and after Kobe carried the Lakers' asses from Game 5 vs. Thunder all the way to the NBA Finals (scoring 30+ in all but one of those games), he took over the worst game of the series (GM7) with an outstanding performance on the glass AND defending in the 4th, which led the comeback and, eventually, the trophy.

 

Once you told me Gasol outscored Bryant in the series, I knew you didn't watch. It wasn't even close. Bryant dropped 70 more points, an average of 10 more per game...which is very easy to notice just by watching. So, if you didn't watch the series, you didn't know who the Finals MVP was.

[Oliver P]

The first thing I wanna say in this thread is that I really don't understand the hate towards Gasol right now... I mean sure he's not been playing well lately and I can agree that Odom's been the second best player of the team for the last month-month and a half, but the fact is that it happens to everyone. And I don't see how insulting Gasol, calling him a sissy and all will help in any way...

 

Besides it's not like Gasol's been playing like that way the whole year, he was totally amazing in the first month and a half of the season... Let's not get over excited here. Gasol still has plenty of time to get back to the way he's played in the beginning of the season and the entire last season.

 

This hate is even more unjustified as the Lakers certainly would not have won those past two years without him.. Kobe was still the best player, I certainly don't say the opposite and I have never understood how people could say that Gasol was the first option but without the great second option that Gasol's been the Lakers would certainly still have 14 rings right now.

 

When John Starks started to play like [expletive] after Olajuwon blocked his shot at the end of the game 6 of the 94 Finals (he lost his basketball for game 7 and the first months of the following season) I didn't call him anything but kept on supporting him and hoped that he would get back to his best level. Which he eventually did..

 

I definitely agree about what Kobe said, Gasol needs to wake up and be more aggressive, but let's not forget that Gasol has brought a lot to the Lakers, there is no doubt about that, so let's try to be a bit fair here.

 

 

Also I would like to react about a few things I read in that thread :

 

 

WHAT?! He didn't win [expletive] by himself. And the Lakers lost the 08 title mainly 'cause of GaSOFT's SOFTNESS.... <_< Damn, I'm still mad at him 'cause of that wasted opportunity.... F#@$#$!@$@!!!! :angry: :angry:

 

It is true that Gasol was quite soft in those Finals but first the first reason why the Lakers lost was rather because of Ariza's injury and second, as I said, the Lakers wouldn't have won two rings without him those last two years.

 

Besides Gasol improved in that area, he was certainly not soft last year against the C's.

 

And by the way instead of being angry at him for this "wasted opportunity", you should rather thank him, cause without him there would not have been any opportunity at all as the Lakers would certainly not have made the Finals, not only in 2008, but also those past two years.

 

(Man, when's Bynum comin' back????)

 

I seriously hope you're not implying that Bynum is better than Gasol right ??!!

 

Last year while Gasol was averaging 19.6 PPG (53.9 FG%), 11.1 RPG and 3.5 APG in the playoffs, Bynum averaged 8.6 PPG, 6.9 RPG, 0.5 APG.

 

The year before Gasol averaged 18.3 PPG (58 FG%), 10.8 RPG, 2.5 APG in the playoffs while Bynum averaged 6.3 PPG, 3.7 RPG and 0.4 APG and was HEAVILY criticized during the whole playoffs.

 

So yeah the Lakers would sure be better if they traded Gasol and kept Bynum...

 

When everyone was talking about how Gasol was the best PF in the NBA, I continued to shake my head and think of how asinine that was. As we progress, it's becoming more clear.

 

You didn't shake your head and thought of how asinine that was in that thread :

 

http://www.otrbasketball.com/forums/topic/7339-is-amare-stoudemire-a-top-5-pf/ :

 

He's the best PF in the game.

 

I'm assuming you're labeling Pau Gasol a center right now.

 

 

1a) Dirk

1b) Gasol

 

Then everyone else.

Edited February 3, 2011 by Oliver P

[Real Deal]

You didn't shake your head and thought of how asinine that was in that thread :

That was when the season first started, and I never stated that he was better than Dirk. Ever.

 

Last month, on TLN, we had a few Lakers fans saying Gasol was, by far, the best PF in the NBA. Not true, at all.

 

Now? It's not even close.

 

Gasol may be the best back-to-the-basket PF in the league, I can see where someone would want to argue for that...which is why I stuck him up there with Dirk. HOWEVER, if we're talking strictly position, Dirk blows him out because he's a legitimate primary scoring option and a franchise player.

 

I'm sure I never made that clear here, but I did elsewhere, when people were slamming Dirk just to stick Gasol at the top of the list.

[Oliver P]

That was when the season first started, and I never stated that he was better than Dirk. Ever.

 

Last month, on TLN, we had a few Lakers fans saying Gasol was, by far, the best PF in the NBA. Not true, at all.

 

I agree with that. I just posted what you said in the other thread cause you said that it was asinine to consider Gasol the best PF in the league. Yet in that other thread you said "1a Dirk ; 1b Gasol" which clearly means that you had Dirk ahead by a very slim margin and so it's like admitting that a case can be made for Gasol at n°1, even if you think that Dirk is the best indeed.

 

If you had said, like you said in this last post, that it was asinine to consider Gasol as the best PF "BY FAR" I would not have posted it. There's a difference...

 

And I definitely agree with that anyhow. I said it myself in that other thread, and in many other posts in other forums, even if I agree that a case can be made for Gasol I've always considered Nowitzki as a better PF than him, and for me Nowitzki was the best PF last year and still is this season.

 

For best big man it's another story though, cause for me a big man is either a center or a PF who can play C, yet Nowitzki is a pure forward and doesn't play at all like a traditional big man (even if he played C at some point of his career but it was not really a success... it was when Nelson was still the coach and Nelson was... weird sometime, I mean when he was in New York he wanted to use Ewing as a PG so...). So it's hard for me to say that Dirk is the best big man indeed because of that.

 

But he plays at PF and is definitely better than all the other PFs in the league right now, there is no doubt about that.

 

Now? It's not even close.

 

It is there that I disagree. So at the beginning of the season you thought that it was very close between the two and now, just because Pau's struggled a bit for barely a month, you think that it's not even close any longer ? I cannot agree with that. As I said this can happen to anyone Gasol might get back to his best soon (and I hope that he will, even if I ain't a fan of him... I like him but I just ain't a fan, Nowitzki is actually my favorite player).

 

I can't judge a player on a few weeks only, I just can't bypass all what he's done since he's a Lakers... Just seems impossible to me.

 

In fact it reminds me of what people said about Jennings when he was fantastic in the beginning of the last season, everyone was already calling him ROY. As I said at the time it was way too early for that, we can't know what will happen next, we had to wait and see if he would keep playing that way... And I remember that I've been quite criticized for it.. Yet Jennings was not named ROY indeed and he never reached that same level again after that.

 

So anyway if Gasol keeps on playing like that for the rest of the season and the playoffs, then and ONLY then I will say that it's not even close, but not before.

Edited February 4, 2011 by Oliver P

[Real Deal]

Like I said, the only reason why I considered Gasol "1b" in that discussion is because he's the better big man. If you ask both to play in the low post, I would take Gasol operating out of it, as a passer and a scorer, over Dirk.

 

But, strictly positional debate? Dirk is the better PF, and I wouldn't think twice about that right now. Amare is better than Gasol, also. I would take Griffin as well, the way he's facilitating, scoring (back-to-the-basket and fast break), and rebounding.

 

Gasol's stats are his worst as a Laker, but even then, they do show he's a productive forward. However, they are painting an unfinished picture. Gasol is very "mild" when we need him the most. He avoids contact. He would rather switch and defend a guard in late-game situations, just to keep him out of the paint.

 

Last night, Gasol was 8-10 shooting the ball. He had MANY more opportunities to shoot the ball, or even post up and call for it, but he didn't take the low post as much as he should've, and he didn't shoot the ball as much when he had it in his hands. It's why Kobe called him out on his lack of aggressive play, and why Jackson made fun of him yesterday (in his comment about being an all-star and not playing hard).

 

Gasol isn't a top three PF in the NBA right now. Dirk, Amare, Griffin...they are doing better scoring, rebounding, and/or facilitating. Some will argue for others as well (ex. Love, Garnett, Aldridge).

 

At this point, I really don't consider Gasol a back-to-the-basket post anymore. He's not a scoring threat. He refuses to average over 15 FGA per game (and did so in Memphis as well, which is shocking), and when the Lakers need him the most, he hasn't shown his face.