MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 (edited) lol lol lol............ You are so bias it's pathetic... I'm no one to be intimidated either... I ain't leaving unless you ban me for speaking the truth... Shot bad in the Finals? Would you like to see MJ's last three Finals appearances? He shot 40-41% in two of them, and I believe 44% in the other. And, go take a look at shot attempts. Kobe took more than Shaq every year after the first ring. He was shooting more AND facilitating, AND defending the best player. Gasol didn't have a single playoff win under his belt. Would you like to know how many shots Gasol put up? He never shot 15 FGA a game...ever. It was the Grizzlies' defense and ability to spread the floor that put them in the playoffs. Did you ever see them play? The 34-win season was due to injuries. You can go check that out, if you'd like. Hamblen went 10-29. Before the injuries, and coached by Rudy T, the Lakers were a decent 24-19. Would you like to know what Jordan's record was when he averaged 37 PPG? It was 40-42. Smush Parker (not in the NBA), Kwame Brown (barely in the NBA), Luke Walton (basically retired now) and Odom (sixth man now) were starting. I'm assuming you didn't watch the Lakers, though. Jordan has zero rings without Pippen. In fact, he has zero winning seasons without Scottie. Excellent logic, right? The 2007 Cavaliers were 4th defensively, 18th on offense. They won their games due to their defense, and LeBron was heavily criticized for his defense until around 2009. If you came here for this, you might as well turn around and go back to an easy-going site you can debate on, because you're out of your league, and everyone will eat you alive, eventually. You'll find that out very, very soon. I always hear the "Jordan couldn't win without Pippen thing"... You my friend delivered it in the worst possible way... Jordan played 2 FULL seasons before the Bulls drafted Pippen... So yes... Jordan's first 2 years he couldn't win... Ok... You remember when Jordan scored 63 points @ Boston?.... That was Jordan's fault they didn't win that series?... They lost that game too... A lot of help Jordan had... in 87-88 the Bulls were 50-32... Pippen was a rookie and averaged 7.9 ppg.... Wow.... Impressive... That was the year Jordan won MVP and DPY... A 24 year old Oakley was his robin... Please... Stop..... Michael Jordan Shot over 50% in each of his first 3 appearances in the NBA Finals.Averaged 31.2 ppg and 11.4 apg in his 1st Finals appearance Averaged 41 ppg, 8.5 rpg and 6.3 apg in the 1993 FinalsAveraged at least 31.2 ppg in 5 of his 6 Finals appearances In his 6-year career in the FinalsAveraged 33.6 ppg, 6 rpg and 6 apg and 48.1 FG% Kobe BryantOnly averaged more than 28.6 once (avg. 32.4 in 09)Most assist averaged was 7.4Averaged 40.5% or less in 4 of his 7 appearances and 43% or less in 6 of 7 In his 7 year career in the FinalsAveraged 24.6 ppg, 5.2 rpg, 4.9 apg and 41.2 FG%Now I know exactly what you are thinking… “Man, that’s only cause Shaq was there for his first 4 appearances.” Very true. However without Shaq, no way Kobe would have those 4 Finals appearances and 3 rings. But lets look at the numbers shall we? Kobe with Shaq in NBA Finals21 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 4.6 apg and 41.1% Kobe without Shaq in NBA Finals28.6 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 5.2 apg and 41.2% Plus the only NBA Finals the Lakers lost with Shaq (04) was the only year that Kobe attempted more shots than Shaq in the Finals. Kobe attempted 29 more FG’s than Shaq, however Shaq still lead the series with 26.6 ppg and shot 63.1% while Kobe had 22.6 and shot 38.1%... So even without Shaq (00-02 and 04) Kobe’s ppg and FG% (08-10) are still nowhere near Jordan’s… Let’s look more into what each player had. Of course Jordan had Pippen. Pippen was great. Pippen averaged 18.9 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 5.9 apg and shot 42.4% in his 6 year Finals career. But, Pau Gasol in his 3 year Finals career has averaged 17.2 ppg, 10.4 rpg and 1.6 bpg. His FG% is 52.8%! I think Pau being compared to Pippen is very reasonable. Let’s not forget about Shaq either! Shaq averaged 33.5 ppg, 14.1 rpg, 2.3 bpg and shot 60.2% in his 4 years that the Lakers made the Finals! So Shaq (4 Finals) + Pau (3 Finals) > Pippen 6 Finals Oh and by the way... Jordan only played 9 full seasons with Pippen and won 6 rings... Kobe played 8 seasons with Shaq It doesn't take a genius to know Shaq > Pippen and almost 4 now with Pau... 12 seasons with future Hall of Famers... Jordan had 9. 6 rings > 5 rings 6 Finals MVP's > 2 Finals MVP's lol lol lol @ you thinking your some ESPN analyst and i'm some bum... Edited April 3, 2011 by MaddSkillz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted April 3, 2011 Owner Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Using advanced stats and thinking they mean something, and ignoring the fact that bigs shoot and rebound better than guards...Jordan's 98 MVP season: 1997-98 BullsTS% - Jordan 7theFG% - Jordan 9thORB% - Jordan 10thDRB% - Jordan 7thTRB% - Jordan 9thAST% - Jordan 4thSTL% - Jordan 5thBLK% - Jordan 8thTO% - Jordan 3rdUSG% - Jordan 1stORtg - Jordan 5thDRtg - Jordan 4thOWS - Jordan 1stDWS - Jordan 2ndWS - Jordan 1stWS/48 - Jordan 2nd Jordan is the GOAT. Fifth in steals? Fourth in assists? He was seventh and ninth shooting the ball? Made the +/- stats meaningless without a response? Check. Prove that most big men have better FG%, rebounding and block numbers, and less turnovers? Check. Prove that Gasol's Grizzlies and LeBron's Cavs weren't a one-man team? Check. Prove that Kobe was attempting more shots than Shaq every season after the first ring? Check. Prove how irrelevant advanced stats are when compared to teammates? Check. Gave reasons and comparisons (to the GOAT) as to why the Kobe-only Lakers were a .500 or better team twice, when Jordan didn't get over .500 until Pippen? Check. Looks like I'm done here. http://thelakersnation.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/ronflex.gif 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 by the way, i'm out for the night... Might be on later... Don't want you thinking i ran away from you cause how dang smart you are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Using advanced stats and thinking they mean something, and ignoring the fact that bigs shoot and rebound better than guards...Jordan's 98 MVP season: 1997-98 BullsTS% - Jordan 7theFG% - Jordan 9thORB% - Jordan 10thDRB% - Jordan 7thTRB% - Jordan 9thAST% - Jordan 4thSTL% - Jordan 5thBLK% - Jordan 8thTO% - Jordan 3rdUSG% - Jordan 1stORtg - Jordan 5thDRtg - Jordan 4thOWS - Jordan 1stDWS - Jordan 2ndWS - Jordan 1stWS/48 - Jordan 2nd Jordan is the GOAT. Fifth in steals? Fourth in assists? He was seventh and ninth shooting the ball? Made the +/- stats meaningless without a response? Check. Prove that most big men have better FG%, rebounding and block numbers, and less turnovers? Check. Prove that Gasol's Grizzlies and LeBron's Cavs weren't a one-man team? Check. Prove that Kobe was attempting more shots than Shaq every season after the first ring? Check. Prove how irrelevant advanced stats are when compared to teammates? Check. Gave reasons and comparisons (to the GOAT) as to why the Kobe-only Lakers were a .500 or better team twice, when Jordan didn't get over .500 until Pippen? Check. Looks like I'm done here. http://thelakersnation.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/ronflex.gif NOW I KNOW I WON LMAO...... You took Jordan's LAST year with the Bulls??!!!!! HAHAHAHAHA.... You mad a 35 year old Jordan can win the MVP, Finals and Finals MVP but Kobe at 32 can't even be #1 in WS???? hahaha.... Jordan was at 35!!! You are one of these kids that thinks Kobe is already better than Jordan... smfh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted April 3, 2011 Owner Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 You're the one making yourself look like a fool. Jordan is the GOAT. You're finding a way to bash Bryant, because you've already stated you hate the Lakers. A rookie Pippen was a lot of help. Did you just give me Scottie's PPG to prove he didn't do much? LOL...what was Rodman's PPG in the second dynasty? The gig is up, bro. You're doing your best, and it's just not good enough...and now you're at the "6 rings > 5 rings" road... Stat kings are easy to dethrone. I was like that about seven years ago, until I started paying more attention to the game itself. Nice talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 And how did Kobe's greatness help them today? lol.... Oh wait... I guess i don't watch basketball though... Cause someone that does would make excuses for 10-27 shooting right? Kobe sure is clutch.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted April 3, 2011 Owner Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 NOW I KNOW I WON LMAO...... You took Jordan's LAST year with the Bulls??!!!!! HAHAHAHAHA.... You mad a 35 year old Jordan can win the MVP, Finals and Finals MVP but Kobe at 32 can't even be #1 in WS???? hahaha.... Jordan was at 35!!! You are one of these kids that thinks Kobe is already better than Jordan... smfh...I'm a 27 year old kid, huh? I stated twice that Jordan was the GOAT. Read a little, kiddo. Jordan's last season with the Bulls, he won the MVP. Legit argument, buddy. Are you comparing age? Would you like to repeat how many seasons Jordan and Kobe played? Kobe is a very old 32. Jordan missed three seasons, and he didn't start his career at age 17. Give up, dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 You're the one making yourself look like a fool. Jordan is the GOAT. You're finding a way to bash Bryant, because you've already stated you hate the Lakers. A rookie Pippen was a lot of help. Did you just give me Scottie's PPG to prove he didn't do much? LOL...what was Rodman's PPG in the second dynasty? The gig is up, bro. You're doing your best, and it's just not good enough...and now you're at the "6 rings > 5 rings" road... Stat kings are easy to dethrone. I was like that about seven years ago, until I started paying more attention to the game itself. Nice talk. lol... You mean until you got tired of losing so you just make the other guy sound like he's a kid and knows nothing?.... lol "good" talk... I'll let you get back to feeling supreme... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted April 3, 2011 Owner Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 And how did Kobe's greatness help them today? lol.... Oh wait... I guess i don't watch basketball though... Cause someone that does would make excuses for 10-27 shooting right? Kobe sure is clutch....Oh, but Kobe was a +3 today, second to Odom (a +4). THAT MUST MEAN SOMETHING! Gasol shot 7-10, but was a ZERO. So fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 I'm a 27 year old kid, huh? I stated twice that Jordan was the GOAT. Read a little, kiddo. Jordan's last season with the Bulls, he won the MVP. Legit argument, buddy. Are you comparing age? Would you like to repeat how many seasons Jordan and Kobe played? Kobe is a very old 32. Jordan missed three seasons, and he didn't start his career at age 17. Give up, dude. Yeah... Jordan didn't play basketball in college or play baseball... He just sat and rested every day... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted April 3, 2011 Owner Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 so you just make the other guy sound like he's a kid and knows nothing?Yes, that's exactly what I did. You're 100% correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 (edited) Oh, but Kobe was a +3 today, second to Odom (a +4). THAT MUST MEAN SOMETHING! Gasol shot 7-10, but was a ZERO. So fun. hanging onto one little thing i said is also a sign of someone that's beat... If you do believe Jordan is the G.O.A.T. and Kobe can't reach him then my mistake... Edited April 3, 2011 by MaddSkillz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Hey i just did you a favor man... I'm the bad guy and your site loves you more now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted April 3, 2011 Owner Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 hanging onto one little thing said is also i sign of someone that's beat... If you do believe Jordan is the G.O.A.T. and Kobe can't reach him then my mistake...I've trumped everything you said. Do I really need to go back? You trying to compare Kobe to a big's production? I gave you all of those advanced stats of Jordan's. Would you like me to compare his FG% and rebounding, and blocks, from any other season of his? Which big man do you want me to compare them to? You brought up the three Kobe-only seasons, one you forgot to talk injuries (first Kobe, then Odom for the rest of the year), two being over .500 and something Jordan didn't do by himself. I'll bring up the other four things I'm looking at if you really need me to. I'll hang on to all of them as long as you're around, because you just made them your crutch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 By the way.... Pippen's OWS his rookie year was -0.4 lmao and his Off Rating was 98 lol lol lol.... He sure was helpful... man... I've never seen numbers so low.... He helped Jordan win MVP cause Jordan had to do more to cover up for his mistakes lmao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted April 3, 2011 Owner Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Hey i just did you a favor man... I'm the bad guy and your site loves you more now Sure thing. Not a single member cares, trust me. Six years, way too many members just like you, and all of them are posting on forums that have either died, or on life support. True talk. Nobody strolls into the site and baits fans in game topics, and starts throwing jabs and acts like this community will open their arms up to it. They will run you out, and it won't be just the Lakers fans. If you want respect, you earn it. We don't bow down to members just because they post, mainly because our quality of posts mean much, much more than our quantity, and that's why we've been up for over six years. Fit in however you think you can, but most will tell you that you need to change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 My point is MJ and LBJ do more to help their team win... You interpret it as a guard vs a big... Not the case... I was showing you how every stat Pau was better at Kobe... Not just rebounds and blocks... Doing that again is what someone does when they're beat... Forget the MJ and Kobe thing cause that's too easy... Any stat you possible want to compare it's Jordan every time... LBJ is closer to MJ than Kobe... Easy..... Easy... As far as what he means to his team and production goes... All of LBJ's stats are closer to MJ's than Kobe's ever was. Kobe was a pure scorer don't get me wrong... I'm talking about efficiency.... FG%, rebounds, assists... All the other stuff... LeBron's Def Rating is always better than Kobe's as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Sure thing. Not a single member cares, trust me. Six years, way too many members just like you, and all of them are posting on forums that have either died, or on life support. True talk. Nobody strolls into the site and baits fans in game topics, and starts throwing jabs and acts like this community will open their arms up to it. They will run you out, and it won't be just the Lakers fans. If you want respect, you earn it. We don't bow down to members just because they post, mainly because our quality of posts mean much, much more than our quantity, and that's why we've been up for over six years. Fit in however you think you can, but most will tell you that you need to change. lol... I thought this was fun... If i have to be a Lakers fan or a Kobe nut rider to fit in then your right... I should leave... I'll take my chance though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaddSkillz Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Anyway man... Good talking to you. I'm out. I look forward to reading you go crazy over LBJ later lol... I know that's comin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted April 3, 2011 Owner Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 lol... I thought this was fun... If i have to be a Lakers fan or a Kobe nut rider to fit in then your right... I should leave... I'll take my chance though.What you won't do is take shots at the community here. There are plenty of non-Lakers fans, and they actually have knowledge of the game. ?QuestionMark?, .50., *Swish*, #24, AboveLegit, Abro, alcstarheel, andreusito, BadgerFan, ballorama, BasX, Big Penny, Blazed49, Buckets!, Built Ford Tough, Cavamatic, Celtics3420, Charlie Sheen, Check my Stats, ChosenOne, Cleveland's Finest, Clutch, Cobb, Confidence248, dabearfan101, Dash, deestillballin, Doc, Dr. Feelgood, EastCoastNiner, Erick Blasco, fish7718, Force, GamerGuy, Guru, Hawks Fly High, htown11, htownborn, J E N, Jammin, Jay Cutler, Jenneral, Jesus Shuttlesworth, JohnWayne, JYD, kingfish, Kobe24, Kobe824, Legacy, Lkr*, Macasero, magicbalala245, MainEv3nt, Mentch, MJ23, MoeRoadKill, Mr. Clutch, Multi-Billionaire, Newman, Nitro, NomarFachix, Oliver P, Phightins, platoon793, Prodigy, Real Deal*, Riot, s.t.a.t., Smitty, SRV, Sublime, Sun Tzu, Taber, The Artesticle, The Truth, TheHutch, trutrojan8, Universe, Vitasoy, Waldo, Warren2ThaG, xphylez, YoungYugo, Yugopotamia All non-Lakers fans, and a lot of them don't like Kobe, but they actually have a brain and respect what he does on the court, and have recognized him as the best player in the game. And they all "fit in" and are a huge part of this community you think you know. That's not even the entire site. Are you done? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macasero Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Hey Amar'e, at least a one legged Pau Gasol is still a better defender than you'll ever be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hawks Fly High Posted April 3, 2011 Popular Post Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 MaddSkillz is STL version 2.0. Dick rides MJ and looks at stats as god. If you actually watch the game Kobe is the closest thing to MJ you will ever get. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Truth Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 MaddSkillz is STL version 2.0. Dick rides MJ and looks at stats as god. If you actually watch the game Kobe is the closest thing to MJ you will ever get.you're judging who someone is as a member based off three or four posts. what's so bad about someone having a different opinion? having read many of MS's posts on HN, I can safely say he respects Kobe's skill. just because he thinks there's a few players better than Kobe doesn't mean he thinks Kobe sucks. you guys are basically chasing him away from the site just because he has a different opinion. his posts in this topic were as informative, compelling, and impressive as anyone's, but because you don't agree with what he says, none of that matters. rather than at least acknowledging the time and effort he puts into his argument, you just insult him and wait for other immature members to give you rep. that my friends, is what's wrong with OTR. don't get me wrong - I love this site. I love the members. but this - this is ridiculous. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Popular Post Real Deal Posted April 4, 2011 Owner Popular Post Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 you're judging who someone is as a member based off three or four posts. what's so bad about someone having a different opinion? having read many of MS's posts on HN, I can safely say he respects Kobe's skill. just because he thinks there's a few players better than Kobe doesn't mean he thinks Kobe sucks. you guys are basically chasing him away from the site just because he has a different opinion. his posts in this topic were as informative, compelling, and impressive as anyone's, but because you don't agree with what he says, none of that matters. rather than at least acknowledging the time and effort he puts into his argument, you just insult him and wait for other immature members to give you rep. that my friends, is what's wrong with OTR. don't get me wrong - I love this site. I love the members. but this - this is ridiculous.He came here baiting the Laker fans, trashing the community. He stated that most of the site was Lakers fans (in the gameday topic), which is absolutely false...and I proved that. He mouthed off about them in the gameday topic. He is in this topic ONLY for that very reason. And if you think something is wrong with OTR, go put up your own damn site, message me in a year and tell me how things are going. Here's what's wrong with OTR: every month or so, we run into trolls, and I do my best to keep them here. We also run into unintelligent posters that I wait for, waiting for them to change and start respecting all 30 fanbases. I'm hard as hell on the Heat, but I won't look like a dumbass and say that LeBron isn't a top three player in the NBA. Same with Wade. I've stated that the Heat can get to the Finals. It's all based on what I watch, not my team and who I hate. you just insult him and wait for other immature members to give you repDon't talk shit on my guys. They have put in far, far more than you have around here. They have done much more for this site. When they see someone that is similar to the other trolls we've had over the last six years, they will call them out. Go ahead and stick yourself in the same boat, dude. We'll continue posting, with or without you. Trust me. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Pissed off because Laker fans are getting baited? Welcome to my world lol. His Kobe argument, even if he presented stats just doesn't hold any water because Kobe is the Lakers driving force. However, his point of Kobe doing no wrong in some people's eyes is most definitely true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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