BadgerFan Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 From Bill Simmons on Twitter: Total FT attempts today with all 4 teams playing equally hard: 71 (Miami/Chicago), 32 (Indy/Philly). That's embarrassing. Doug Collins: @WindhorstESPN*Doug Collins on FT disparity: "I could (comment) but my grand kids would lose their college fund."*14 minutes ago This is the reason why the NBA is such a joke. Small market teams have no chance at all in getting any calls from the refs. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitro Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 The top 2 teams this season in FTA's were small-market teams (Nuggets and Thunders), so don't give me that. Philly was bottom 5 in the league this season in FTA's per game, while Rose was attacking the basket like crazy which is why the Bulls had such a big edge against the Pacers. Neither the Pacers or Sixers have a guy that gets to the FT line anywhere near as much as LeBron, Wade or Rose do, so of course they will be at a disadvantage. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poe Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 (edited) The Pacers and the Sixers were taking long jumpers, while the Bulls and the Heat were attacking the basket into traffic. If free throw distribution was always even no matter where shots are coming from or how they are defended, THEN the NBA would be a joke. Edited April 16, 2011 by Poe 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadgerFan Posted April 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Neither the Pacers or Sixers have a guy that gets to the FT line anywhere near as much as LeBron, Wade or Rose do, so of course they will be at a disadvantage. Coming from a Heat fan, I am not surprised. Do you think it's odd that superstars are ALWAYS the one getting to the FT line? Did you forget when Wade KICKED Young and got the foul called on Young? Seriously, if you breathe on either Wade or Lebron, a foul will be called. It is not fair to both sides, a team with a superstar or a bigger market will ALWAYS get more calls than a team without a superstar. If you don't think the refs are biased, than I feel bad for you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitro Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Coming from a Heat fan, I am not surprised. Nets fan, but nice try. Do you think it's odd that superstars are ALWAYS the one getting to the FT line? Did you forget when Wade KICKED Young and got the foul called on Young? Seriously, if you breathe on either Wade or Lebron, a foul will be called. It is not fair to both sides, a team with a superstar or a bigger market will ALWAYS get more calls than a team without a superstar. If you don't think the refs are biased, than I feel bad for you. I never said the refs aren't biased, but there it has little to nothing to do with being from a small or large market. Superstars do get calls other players don't get, but at the same time how many perimeter players attack the basket like Wade, LeBron and Rose do? The answer is none, they are the 3 best in the league at getting to the rim and finishing. When you are constantly attacking the basket, you will get to the FT line a lot. It is why AI at one time took over 11FTA's per game, and why his 'small market' Sixers were among the league leaders in FTA's. Also, when you attack the basket like they do, and know how to initiate and sell the contact like they do, it makes it even harder to fairly judge foul calls against them as opposed to your usual role player. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poe Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 (edited) It is not fair to both sides, a team with a superstar or a bigger market will ALWAYS get more calls than a team without a superstar. Maybe because superstars are SO good at scoring, teams play them extra physically - particularly around the basket - to attempt to slow down their production and as a result, the superstar gets to the free throw line. Imagine that! Ever considered the ability to get to the free throw line a skill as well? That players have an inherent ability to know how to draw more contact from their defender? Like pumpfaking to get a defender to jump into you? Imagine that! Yet, somehow the average player is supposed to get to the free throw line at the same rate? That when they aren't as much of a scoring threat and are far more likely to take spot-up jumpers and easier finishes around the basket than anything else, teams will look play them just as physically, waste a limited number of fouls, and risk getting a low option scorer a free chance to score at the strike? ESPECIALLY when the odds of the average player scoring is FAR less than a SUPERSTAR?? Sorry, I can't imagine that. Edited April 16, 2011 by Poe 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadgerFan Posted April 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Nets fan, but nice try. I never said the refs aren't biased, but there it has little to nothing to do with being from a small or large market. Superstars do get calls other players don't get, but at the same time how many perimeter players attack the basket like Wade, LeBron and Rose do? The answer is none, they are the 3 best in the league at getting to the rim and finishing. When you are constantly attacking the basket, you will get to the FT line a lot. It is why AI at one time took over 11FTA's per game, and why his 'small market' Sixers were among the league leaders in FTA's. Also, when you attack the basket like they do, and know how to initiate and sell the contact like they do, it makes it even harder to fairly judge foul calls against them as opposed to your usual role player. Let me ask you this. If you were David Stern, would you rather see the Miami Heat advance or the Sixers? If you were David Stern, would you rather see the Chicago Bulls advance, or the Indiana Pacers? The NBA is all about ratings and money, and it will always will be. The refs have been known to fix games as well, so when you see FT disparity's like this, it makes you wonder. Take a look at this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p_HeQme1VU&feature=player_embedded Look at about 5 seconds in. That should have been an and 1, and you know that probably would have been a flagrant foul if it was James or Wade making the layup. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AboveLegit Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 No one on Philly averaged more than 5FT's per game this season. Granger is the only one on his team that averaged more than 4FT's a game, and today he took 8 three's, with most of his 2 pointers coming off jumpshots. Coincidence that both of these teams didn't shoot many FT's today? I'm not saying there isn't superstar treatment in this league, because there is. John Wall, who relies on his ability to drive in order to score, only averaged around 5FT's a game. He gets fouled almost everytime he goes up for a lay up, and the refs hardly call it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadgerFan Posted April 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 The best call of them all: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBtoJpONR7w That should have wiped 2 points right there. Should have been an offensive foul. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitro Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Let me ask you this. If you were David Stern, would you rather see the Miami Heat advance or the Sixers? If you were David Stern, would you rather see the Chicago Bulls advance, or the Indiana Pacers? The NBA is all about ratings and money, and it will always will be. The refs have been known to fix games as well, so when you see FT disparity's like this, it makes you wonder. That's all fine and dandy, but the Sixers were among the bottom of the league ALL SEASON in FTA's, while the Heat were among the top of the league. NOT A SINGLE PLAYER ON THE SIXERS AVERAGED OVER 4.5FTA'S DURING THE REGULAR SEASON. Now, why would you expect it to be any different in the post-season? It has nothing to do with Stern wanting to advance the Heat, it has to do with Philly having very few players capable of drawing fouls with great consistency, while the Heat have arguably the 2 best in the entire NBA. Take a look at this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p_HeQme1VU&feature=player_embedded Look at about 5 seconds in. That should have been an and 1, and you know that probably would have been a flagrant foul if it was James or Wade making the layup. That would have been one extra free throw. Show me how many plays in the game Wade and LeBron got free throws on, and tell me how many of them shouldn't have been called fouls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poe Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Look at about 5 seconds in. If you are going to convince people that your conspiracy is true, at least give a good example. Jones' arm was moving downward, not out. Young clearly fell out of his own momentum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitro Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 The best call of them all: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBtoJpONR7w That should have wiped 2 points right there. Should have been an offensive foul. He got fouled before he even kicked his leg out... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadgerFan Posted April 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 He got fouled before he even kicked his leg out... Putting your head down and running into a defender is not a foul, I am sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadgerFan Posted April 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 If you are going to convince people that your conspiracy is true, at least give a good example. Jones' arm was moving downward, not out. Young clearly fell out of his own momentum. He clearly fell on his own, even though Jones arm was extended right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poe Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 That should have wiped 2 points right there. Should have been an offensive foul. There you go. That's a bad call. It shouldn't have been a foul on the D, and maybe you are right about it being offensive. But one example doesn't prove much. You need to show consistency. That the refs consistently make bad calls to give star players the advantage simply because they are stars. At least 15% of calls made for superstars that shouldn't have been fouls. Likewise, also prove that the refs don't miss any foul calls against superstars. That there is a no-call less than 15% of times where the star player gets enough contact from the D where there should have been a foul call. And lastly, prove that the percentages are actually different between stars and non-star players. That stars get 30% of non-fouls called AS fouls, and that non-stars get only 5% (for example). THEN, and only then, will I be listening. Otherwise, I'll only agree with you as far as the idea that NBA refs simply suck at their job, and it needs improvement overall. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitro Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Putting your head down and running into a defender is not a foul, I am sorry. Why do you think Corey Maggette always gets to the FT line? And I don't believe he's a superstar, nor does he play for a big market team... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Coming from a Heat fan, I am not surprised. Do you think it's odd that superstars are ALWAYS the one getting to the FT line? Did you forget when Wade KICKED Young and got the foul called on Young? Seriously, if you breathe on either Wade or Lebron, a foul will be called. It is not fair to both sides, a team with a superstar or a bigger market will ALWAYS get more calls than a team without a superstar. If you don't think the refs are biased, than I feel bad for you. Let me ask you this. If you were David Stern, would you rather see the Miami Heat advance or the Sixers? If you were David Stern, would you rather see the Chicago Bulls advance, or the Indiana Pacers? The NBA is all about ratings and money, and it will always will be. The refs have been known to fix games as well, so when you see FT disparity's like this, it makes you wonder. Putting your head down and running into a defender is not a foul, I am sorry. He clearly fell on his own, even though Jones arm was extended right? http://images1.memegenerator.net/ImageMacro/5847474/I-SEE-YOU-TALKING-But-all-I-hear-is-blah-blah-blah-my-moms-a-black-hole-of-pleasure.jpg?imageSize=Medium&generatorName=SGTHARTMAN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadgerFan Posted April 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Why do you think Corey Maggette always gets to the FT line? And I don't believe he's a superstar, nor does he play for a big market team... I'll give you Maggette, he is a prime example of that. It shouldn't be called though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted April 17, 2011 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 Lots of whining and bitching in this thread about guys who are the 2 best slashers in the game going to the free throw line. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lkr Posted April 17, 2011 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 (edited) http://images1.memegenerator.net/ImageMacro/5847474/I-SEE-YOU-TALKING-But-all-I-hear-is-blah-blah-blah-my-moms-a-black-hole-of-pleasure.jpg?imageSize=Medium&generatorName=SGTHARTMANWhat a great response. It is the pony members that make the site that look childish though. Yes, LBJ and Dwhistle are going to get calls. Yes, they will get calls when they aren't touched. To deny it is stupid. It obviously happens and we all know why it happens. If a Heat fan is going to say that they deserve their calls, I'd point you to the 06 NBA Finals and tell you to rewatch it. You either accept it and keep watching or you can complain, but nothing will change unfortunately. The offensive player always gets an unfair advantage in the NBA, which makes it sickening to watch compared to NCAA and international leagues.If you compare the NBA to the NFL, you will see that the NBA is doing something wrong with promoting their league. The NFL consistently has had successful small market teams(the market size really isn't that small, they just don't have a national following) over the past decade(St. Louis, Tennessee, Carolina, New England before the start of the decade, Seattle, Arizona, etc etc etc). Edited April 17, 2011 by Rainbow Dash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitro Posted April 17, 2011 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 If you compare the NBA to the NFL, you will see that the NBA is doing something wrong with promoting their league. The NFL consistently has had successful small market teams(the market size really isn't that small, they just don't have a national following) over the past decade(St. Louis, Tennessee, Carolina, New England before the start of the decade, Seattle, Arizona, etc etc etc). I don't think it has to do with promotion, but rather contracts and how often players switch teams in the NBA, namely superstars who can change the balance of power so easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lkr Posted April 17, 2011 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 I don't think it has to do with promotion, but rather contracts and how often players switch teams in the NBA, namely superstars who can change the balance of power so easily.The NBA draft is inferior to the NFL draft, making it harder for a team to actually build talent. If you get someone good, they're just going to leave because you can't build a team. I don't know if promotion was the right term to use in this case, but the NBA really makes it hard for young teams. The worst team in the NFL is guaranteed the first pick, which is something the NBA needs to go to. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted April 17, 2011 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 Hold on, a Laker fan is telling me about NBA refs giving players superstar treatment? Lol. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Lkr Posted April 17, 2011 Popular Post Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 Hold on, a Laker fan is telling me about NBA refs giving players superstar treatment? Lol.I've pointed out numerous times when the Lakers have been getting stupid calls in their favor. Sorry that I'm not a complete homer with my team like you are 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted April 17, 2011 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 (edited) I've pointed out numerous times when the Lakers have been getting stupid calls in their favor. Sorry that I'm not a complete homer with my team like you are It has nothing to do with anyone being a homer. This thread is bitching about 2 superstars who are the best at getting to the basket in the NBA getting a lot of free throws. Same with Derrick Rose, they are all attackers. Whereas Philly and Indiana were shooting primarily jumpers today. Everyone knows superstars get a lot of calls in the NBA, but today isn't really a great example aside from maybe Rose getting 21 FT's or something like that. Pretty sure it was AL who posted how no one on Philly gets to the line all that much anyways. Edited April 17, 2011 by Flash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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