Kobe reflects on time with Kwame and Smush

[?QuestionMark?]

Dude, lol, if he was being played at the center position, it's different, but he was in the roster as a small forward in the triangle. When he was starting, he was at the SF position, with Mihm/Kwame and Odom at the five and four.

 

Kwame, Mihm, and Odom were originally starting together until Mihm got hurt. Cook got the start at the 4. He wasn't chasing SFs on the perimeter.

 

I'm saying Turiaf should have taken all of Cook's minutes and then taken some of Kwame's. Especially when Kwame had no one to defend (Shaq, Duncan, KG, etc.) because then he was a total liability at both ends. At least Turiaf would swat and catch and finish.

 

 

Phil is not dumb enough to take Odom out of the starting five, and he's not dumb enough to put Turiaf at the PF position in the triangle. Cook was a SF that season, and saying that Turiaf needed to play more minutes than Cook is saying that Kwame and Mihm needed to play less (or Odom less), and there's no way on Earth that Ronny was better than those two.

 

Cook was NOT a SF except in emergency situations which were rare (I can only think of a game in Houston).

 

I'm not advocating removing Odom (I just said LA needed to go with talent) or Mihm, I said Turiaf needed to take Cook's minutes and some of Kwame's.

 

Turiaf was not better than Kwame when Kwame had someone to guard, but against teams with no inside threat, I'd rather have a big like Turiaf who could actually make a catch under the hoop for an easy bucket. And one who would actually attempt to rotate defensively instead of just watching as teams ran layup drills on them.

 

I'm not sure what you were wanting. There were three centers on the team. Turiaf was one. Once Mihm was hurt, Cook was starting at the SF position, with Odom and Kwame at the four and five. Cook was never playing center. Kwame was up to about 40-43 minutes a game without Mihm, and Odom was at the five at some points of the game (very few minutes there).

 

Cook was not a SF, much less a starting SF. Luke Walton got the start there when Mihm went down.

 

I wanted Cook to be cemented on the bench. Let Turiaf be the first big off the bench and get some run at the 5 with Odom, or play at the 4 with Kwame. Even with a healthy Mihm, Turiaf should have gotten Cook's minutes.

 

So, again, it was either play Odom at the five for about 3-4 minutes, or play Turiaf 3-4 minutes more. It had nothing to do with Cook. He was pushed up to the PF position, and Walton was getting around 35 minutes a night because of it. You can go check the games if you'd like, but the triangle doesn't operate with a center pulling out to the three-point line every play, and Odom was the only guy that could take the low post on the roster (other than Drew, who didn't play, and Mihm being injured).

 

Offensively triangles are interchangable. It's why Cook as a PF played like a spot up SG in the tri. But his defense was just soooo horrible, he gave up as many or more points than he got.

 

Turiaf could have found success offensively within the tri. He was one of the only players that would dive to the basket off a Kobe double team in the post. He had a pretty decent jump shot out to 15 feet when he got his feet set. But as I said, he was the only finisher at the rim other than Kobe. Never mind Cook chucking 28 foot three pointers, I'd rather have Turiaf making those easy hoops underneath that LA desperately lacked.

Edited October 13, 2011 by ?QuestionMark?

[Real Deal]

Kwame, Mihm, and Odom were originally starting together until Mihm got hurt. They then went with Kwame/Odom/Luke.

That's what I said. Kwame/Mihm (meaning Kwame OR Mihm) and Odom were starting at the four and five, Cook at the three.

 

And, yes, Cook was starting at the three. If you need to see it yourself...

 

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2006_start.html

 

Everyone in Lakerland remembers Phil removing Odom from the SF position VERY early in the season. We all laughed about it, as fans, because he was supposed to be playing Pippen's role, and Phil started to post him up, moved him up to the PF position, and was starting Cook at SF (no other place he could be).

 

There are no triangle sets that allow Cook to spot up, all the time, at the PF position. Cook was getting a few minutes at the four, of course, when Odom had to rest (but this was actually rare, because Cook didn't play much himself), but he was a starting three. Not sure who thinks differently, and maybe Cook was defending PF's every now and then back on defense, but in that triangle offense, a third of the way through the season up until the end of it, Cook and Odom switched positions, and that's according to Phil, who clearly stated he moved Odom to the four and changed his role entirely.

[Real Deal]

Offensively triangles are interchangable. It's why Cook as a PF played like a spot up SG in the tri. But his defense was just soooo horrible, he gave up as many or more points than he got.

No they aren't. Roles in the offense are interchangeable, not positions. There's a difference between the two. You can distribute the roles wherever you like, primary scoring options, post play, whatever...but you can't run your post players out to the three every play, and that's all Brian did because, well, he wasn't playing the four anymore.

 

I've played in the offense, and I helped coach it for two years. Yeah, technically, all positions in any offense are interchangeable if we're talking about roles, but you can't suddenly run your PF out of position, expecting the SF (in the set) to take the PF's place because, most of the time, he's playing on the other side of the court, and you're not going to set up the actual triangle correctly if you're doing that. There's no way. Cook was using screens. Teams read Cook as the SF because that's what he was, and so they stick the quicker frontcourt player on him, to chase him off the screens and make sure he wasn't getting wide open looks all game long.

 

If you took the triangle and told Phil to coach it in Dallas, he would strongly consider playing Shawn Marion at the PF position, and having Dirk play the three, to accommodate his range. Dirk can show post, sure the hell can, but if you give him 23 feet of effectiveness, and remove the responsibilities of screening for other guys and fighting underneath for deep low post position, he's going to be your league MVP.

[Warren2ThaG]

[?QuestionMark?]

That's what I said. Kwame/Mihm (meaning Kwame OR Mihm) and Odom were starting at the four and five, Cook at the three.

 

And, yes, Cook was starting at the three. If you need to see it yourself...

 

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2006_start.html

 

Everyone in Lakerland remembers Phil removing Odom from the SF position VERY early in the season. We all laughed about it, as fans, because he was supposed to be playing Pippen's role, and Phil started to post him up, moved him up to the PF position, and was starting Cook at SF (no other place he could be).

 

There are no triangle sets that allow Cook to spot up, all the time, at the PF position. Cook was getting a few minutes at the four, of course, when Odom had to rest (but this was actually rare, because Cook didn't play much himself), but he was a starting three. Not sure who thinks differently, and maybe Cook was defending PF's every now and then back on defense, but in that triangle offense, a third of the way through the season up until the end of it, Cook and Odom switched positions, and that's according to Phil, who clearly stated he moved Odom to the four and changed his role entirely.

 

We're going to get caught up in semantics by going back and forth about position. You want to say he's a SF, I want to say he's a PF. It really doesn't matter. My point isn't whether Turiaf or Cook should have gotten PT at SF. I would have had Luke and George get the majority of those minutes.

 

My bigger issue is Cook should not have played at all, especially when LA had better players on the bench. All those minutes Cook got that season should have been distributed among the rest of the players, including Turiaf so that he'd get more run even if it's just a few 3-5 minutes spots when Mihm, Kwame, and Odom were healthy and getting most of the minutes. When Mihm got hurt, Phil should have gone with Luke or George to start and Turiaf's PT should have definately been increased.

 

Cook was fool's gold. Yeah he spread the floor and was an excellent pick and pop player. But he couldn't defend, swat, board, rotated, pass, jump, run, got lazy, played outside of himself too often, was a black hole, and gave up more points than he got.

 

Cook should have never gotten off the bench, much less average 19 mpg while Turiaf rotted on the bench. Not when you already have Kwame and Smush out there. Turiaf's energy alone would have been worth him getting PT with that team. But it's just Phil's stubborness that kept him (and Bynum for that matter), benched.