Playoffs: Cavs or other team?

[billt chamberlain]

Alrighty, its pretty weird that our team has had the privilege to face the cavs three times in a row the last three years we made the playoffs. my question is, if the wizards make the playoffs would you rather us continue our little traditional feud with the cavs and play them in the first round, or play a different team eastern team in the first round. this is purely from a fans point of view. its pretty arguable that the cavs will have a top two spot next season, so that would mean the wizards would have to finish 7th or 8th to matchup against them, and i would be pissed if we don't at least make it to the fifth seed, so thats why this thread is purely from a fans point of view. if the wizards are the real deal(lol) and the cavs are still favorites to go far in the east than we could eventually end up facing each other in the ecf(i think, remember im not going by seedings for this thread), so facing the cavs in the ecf might be a more entertaining matchup than the first round like we have been accustomed to. im all for this feud and have and still believed that we have had the better team each and every time we played them, so it grinds my gears that i look back and we are 0-3 against them, and it would make me happy to knock them out of the first round on national tv. but, im still sort of sick of seeing lebron and his lackie's all the time, and wouldn't mind versing another team like the hawks, celtics, magic, heat, sixers, etc. just to see where we are as a team and see if we can actually compete in the playoffs.

 

so would you rather us go against the cavs in the first round, or see whats it like to go against a different team for a change?

[Real Deal]

Honestly, if I were a Wizards fan, I'd want to avoid the Cavaliers as much as possible. There's nobody on the roster that can even slow down LeBron, and I'm not sure if Haywood can contain even an old Shaq, even though he's a good defensive player.

 

Not to mention it would be a tough, tough, tough loss if it happened for a fourth consecutive time.

[JWaLL]

I think I speak for everyone when I say we would rather face any team in the East in the first round that isn't the Cavs.

 

Odds are that the Cavs would knock us out of the playoffs next year if we were to face them at any point, so the Wizards have a better chance of beating any other team in the East. Not trying to diss your entire post lol but think about what you're asking.

[Real Deal]

Well, is it Cleveland, or Boston?

 

I'd hate to have to play either of those teams if I were the Wizards.

 

Maybe even the Magic.

 

You guys need defense from 1-4. Big time. I've said it many times before: Washington has been in the bottom ten defensively for a long time now, and I believe in the bottom five for a few years.

 

If you want to make some noise, defense is the way to go when you're playing contenders.

[JWaLL]

Well, is it Cleveland, or Boston?

 

I'd hate to have to play either of those teams if I were the Wizards.

 

Maybe even the Magic.

 

You guys need defense from 1-4. Big time. I've said it many times before: Washington has been in the bottom ten defensively for a long time now, and I believe in the bottom five for a few years.

 

If you want to make some noise, defense is the way to go when you're playing contenders.

I definitely fear the Cavs over the Celtics. When we matched up against the Celtics when we were almost fully healthy (everyone except Arenas at full strength), we were able to beat them a number of times. I believe we won all but one of the matchups between us 2 seasons ago. With the Cavs though, we don't have anyone who can truly hold Lebron's numbers down (we use Deshawn... lol). Obviously all 3 teams would give us problems, but we'd definitely have a greater chance at beating the Celtics or Magic if we faced them in the first round than the Cavs.

[Cleveland's Finest]

Wizards are only getting past the first round with an extreme upset or opposing team injury problems if they face Orlando, Boston, or Cleveland in the first round.

 

But if they get the 4 seed or face Atl, Miami, or whoever has the 4 seed, they can advance. Imo, Washington has as much of a chance as Miami of getting the 4 seed.

 

I'd lol if the Cavs and Wizards somehow met up. I don't want to have anything to do with Washington so it doesn't take away from our focus if Gilbert or DeShawn smack talk.

[AboveLegit]

Wizards should be able to take the fourth seed, thus facing ATL or Miami in the playoffs. Then we have a real chance at the second round.

 

But I wouldn't call it a sweep if we faced the C's or Cavs or Magic. Now with this lineup.

[Built Ford Tough]

If I were a Wizard fan, I would want no part of LeBron and the Cavs. The Wizards didn't matchup well with them in the past, and I think that with the additions the Cavs have made this past offseason, they match up even worse with them now. LeBron can decide to go off whenever he wants against them as they don't have anybody with the combonation of size, quickness and strength to defend him, but with Shaq now on the team, they don't have anybody big enough to contain him either. Haywood is a good defender, but aside from him, they really have no chance at stopping Shaq either and Haywood would not be able to do it himself. The additions of Parker and Moon give the Cavs some more size on the peimeter and would help them on the defensive end of the floor against Butler and Miller as well. I think that the Cavs are just an absolute matchup nightmare for the Wizards and would not want to run into them at all.

 

As long as the Wizards managed to avoid any of the big three teams in the East, I think that they would have a shot at advancing into the second round. Toronto would probably be the most ideal matchup for them as they have historically played well against them and both teams are offensive oriented teams that will look to outscore their opponents to get the victory. That would be a straight up shoot out. Whoever decides to play defense during that series would probably end up winning it. That would be an entertaining series to watch, that is for sure.

 

But really though, anybody from 4-8 in the East next season would be able to beat each other in a series in my opinion. Teams are going to be fighting hard for thoe 4 and 5 seeds to avoid having to matchup with the Cavs, Celtics or Magic.

[billt chamberlain]

grrrrr we're gonna sweep the cavs in 3 games if we play them.

[JWaLL]

grrrrr we're gonna sweep the cavs in 3 games if we play them.

We won't, but it's good to stay optimistic.

[billt chamberlain]

We won't, but it's good to stay optimistic.

 

 

i don't know man, it would be kind of hard to sweep them in 2 games, but if you think we can, than i think we can. i love your enthusiam.

[Real Deal]

Odds of you guys getting swept against the Cavs, for real?

[billt chamberlain]

^^^not swept, but i still think it would be too much against us for us to win against the cavs in the first round. call me a conspiracy nut, but tim donaghe helps prove my point. there is no way in hell the cavs led by lebron will lose to the wizards in the first round ever. it won't be completely because of officiating, but they would have a nice part in it. i doubt we get swept by them though.

[Real Deal]

there is no way in hell the cavs led by lebron will lose to the wizards in the first round ever.

Yeah, but we could've all said the same thing about the Lakers being led by Kobe as well, when they played Phoenix in the first round.

 

I will say this much: if Washington were to trade for someone like Raja Bell or Shane Battier, you guys would have enough offense to beat that Cleveland team, because not only you get a defender to at least attempt to slow down LeBron, but you also get a shooter, and if Arenas ever gets back to normal (which I don't think he will), all of your worries lie at the power forward position, since Jamison would allow 30-35 points per game.

 

Since the Cavaliers don't have someone like Amare, Duncan or Gasol playing the four, it should be an interesting battle.

 

But again, you guys don't have anything to put in front of LeBron, and he's liable to average 40-45 per game against you guys in a series this year, seeing that his offensive game has improved a bit more from what it was just a few years ago.

[billt chamberlain]

^^^definitely.

 

 

i always talk about how the cavs are a horrible team without lebron, but they matchup up against us perfectly. we have always been crappy at defending the three and defending the paint. time and time again lebron would get his in the paint, or kick it out to a shooter open on the three point line whether it be jones,marshall, west, williams. and then someone like drew gooden who is a decent player could have a monster game against us because we sucked at defending the paint. it doesn't make things better now that they have crafty guards like mo and delonte to do more than just shoot, and shaq is a big improvement over the likes of gooden, joe smith, varejao, and ben wallace inside. they just matchup against us too good that its weird. but then the celtics matchup against them almost perfectly so i guess that makes me feel better lol.

 

 

 

im happy that we got flip as a coach, but on the flipside(nice pun)it troubles me that he had squad with rip,billups,prince, and sheed and couldn't put the brakes on lebron. we are built for offense while those piston teams were anchored by defense and could play offense, so i doubt if he can put us over the hump to battle elite teams in the playoffs unless we make some more moves to get us some defensive players.

Edited August 7, 2009 by billt chamberlain

[Real Deal]

Flip couldn't do anything with the Pistons because he's an offensive-minded coach, and the more he preached offense, the less the Pistons learned about other teams.

 

It wasn't just LeBron they couldn't stop. They found out that Dwyane Wade was too much for them in 2006, and just two seasons ago, Boston had too much firepower.

 

Detroit lost their contender label when they lost Larry Brown. Now we're seeing a Charlotte Bobcats squad that placed around 6th or 7th defensively in points per 100 allowed, while Flip Saunders had his two best seasons in Detroit, third best with Kevin Garnett who is, ironically, one of the better defensive players in the NBA.

 

So having Flip coach an offensive-minded team that really only has one true defensive-minded player in Brendan Haywood...I'm really not sure what to expect, but I wouldn't bet money that they'll contend for a title, despite having all of that talent in Butler, a healthy Arenas, Miller, Foye and Jamison.

 

Who knows, though.

[Cleveland's Finest]

^^^definitely.

 

 

i always talk about how the cavs are a horrible team without lebron, but they matchup up against us perfectly. we have always been crappy at defending the three and defending the paint. time and time again lebron would get his in the paint, or kick it out to a shooter open on the three point line whether it be jones,marshall, west, williams. and then someone like drew gooden who is a decent player could have a monster game against us because we sucked at defending the paint. it doesn't make things better now that they have crafty guards like mo and delonte to do more than just shoot, and shaq is a big improvement over the likes of gooden, joe smith, varejao, and ben wallace inside. they just matchup against us too good that its weird. but then the celtics matchup against them almost perfectly so i guess that makes me feel better lol.

 

 

 

im happy that we got flip as a coach, but on the flipside(nice pun)it troubles me that he had squad with rip,billups,prince, and sheed and couldn't put the brakes on lebron. we are built for offense while those piston teams were anchored by defense and could play offense, so i doubt if he can put us over the hump to battle elite teams in the playoffs unless we make some more moves to get us some defensive players.

 

How are the Cavs "horrible" without LeBron.

 

We still would have 2 allstars on our team. Parker would step in for LeBron with 15 ppg and we'd win 35-40 games. That's putting it loosely. I thik we'd be a 45 win team because Shaq would play his [expletive] off being the franchise player again.

Edited August 7, 2009 by Cleveland's Finest

[Built Ford Tough]

How are the Cavs "horrible" without LeBron.

 

We still would have 2 allstars on our team. Parker would step in for LeBron with 15 ppg and we'd win 35-40 games. That's putting it loosely. I thik we'd be a 45 win team because Shaq would play his [expletive] off being the franchise player again.

 

Mo Williams was only an All Star because the league wanted to reward the Cavs fantastic play by giving them two All Stars and also because of the fact that two guards were injured and unable to participate in the game. Mo Williams is not an All Star caliber player and everybody knows that. If he puts up the same numbers on another team, he isn't even in any sort of consideration for the All Star game as evident by his last two seasons with the Bucks. He is a good player, but he rode LeBron's coattails to an All Star apperance and if it wasn't for injuries, he wouldn't even have been an All Star last season and even then, it is arguable as to whether or not he was even deserving of being named Jameer Nelson's replacement (I'm not getting into that though).

 

As for Parker scoring 15 points a game, give me a break. As a Toronto Raptors fan, I can tell you with certainty that he is not capable of putting up 15 points a game. He is a solid role player that will knock down shots if left open and will player above average defense, but he is declining and anybody that has watched him consistently over the past 3 seasons can tell you that the Anthony Parker that we saw in his first season back from Maccabi Tel Aviv and the Anthony Parker that we see know are not even close to being the same player. He simply doesn't have what it takes anymore to score 15 points a night in the NBA. Even as a third option, even second at times (not often though), he was never any higher than 12.5 and is coming off of a season in which his point totals dropped to 10.7 and his shooting percentages plummeted across the board. He is declining.

 

Lastly, at this point in Shaq's career, do you really think that he is reliable enough to carry a team? I'm not going to say that he is or isn't but one thing that has to be noted is that the Suns training staff did a wonderful job keeping Shaq on the court and the cold Cleveland weather is not going to help somebody that has a history of injuries. Shaq may be able to carry the team without LeBron, but I wouldn't bank on it.

 

I don't think that the Cavs are a horrible team without LeBron as they would still be one of the better defensive teams in the league and have some players in Williams and Shaq that are effective offensive players (and West as well), but they are a borderline playoff team with LeBron on the roster at best in my opinion and I don't think that they would be able to win 45 games without LBJ at all.

 

You obviously know more about the Cavs than I do though, so there is a good chance that you have picked something up about the players on the roster that I haven't through my limited times watching them (well I wouldn't say limited, but you get my drift). You are wrong about Anthony Parker though lol.

[JWaLL]

i don't know man, it would be kind of hard to sweep them in 2 games, but if you think we can, than i think we can. i love your enthusiam.

Wait what? I wasn't being enthusiastic lol. I thought you said we were going to sweep the Cavs all 3 times we play them... and I said we wouldn't haha.

[billt chamberlain]

Wait what? I wasn't being enthusiastic lol. I thought you said we were going to sweep the Cavs all 3 times we play them... and I said we wouldn't haha.

nah man i was joking(you'll find that out sooner or later), and meant that we would sweep the cavs in 3 games in the playoffs(impossible, since it takes 4 games to win a series).

 

as for the guy who said the cavs aren't a horrible team without lebron. i didn't mean with shaq. i meant the past three times we have played them in the playoffs. let me rephrase that and say the cavs have always been a good defensive team, but lackluster everywhere else without lebron. also your logic of parker being able to step up and lead the team without lebron is laughable. 15 ppg(which he wouldn't get as bft already pointed out) from parker is way different than 15 points from lebron.

[The Goods]

Wizards should want no part of the Cavs in the playoffs, LeBron and company would in my mind sweep them. Stevenson would get torched by LeBron again, and they got no presence inside to guard Shaq. The Wizards have a good trio in Arenas-Butler-Jamison and they should be able to compete for a 5-7 spot in the East and avoid the Cavs in the first round.

[JWaLL]

Wizards should want no part of the Cavs in the playoffs, LeBron and company would in my mind sweep them. Stevenson would get torched by LeBron again, and they got no presence inside to guard Shaq. The Wizards have a good trio in Arenas-Butler-Jamison and they should be able to compete for a 5-7 spot in the East and avoid the Cavs in the first round.

I agree with most of what you said, but a few things to add:

 

1. Deshawn isn't going to play nearly as much as the 07-08 season when he was the one to guard Lebron, so no one can really say he is going to get "torched" by him.

2. Haywood's interior defense is very underrated, he can do a decent job containing someone like Shaq. He won't shut him down, but he can definitely pose a threat to him.

3. You said we have a chance at the 5-7 spot, so who would you put in the 4th seed? I see us competing for a 4-6 spot.

[The Goods]

I agree with most of what you said, but a few things to add:

 

1. Deshawn isn't going to play nearly as much as the 07-08 season when he was the one to guard Lebron, so no one can really say he is going to get "torched" by him.

2. Haywood's interior defense is very underrated, he can do a decent job containing someone like Shaq. He won't shut him down, but he can definitely pose a threat to him.

3. You said we have a chance at the 5-7 spot, so who would you put in the 4th seed? I see us competing for a 4-6 spot.

I would put the Hawks in the 4th seed. Then teams like 76ers, Wizards, Pistons behind them.

[JWaLL]

I would put the Hawks in the 4th seed. Then teams like 76ers, Wizards, Pistons behind them.

I'd be shocked if the Pistons made the playoffs this year. But I can see the Hawks and Heat posing as threats for the 4th seed, but I feel we have just as good of a chance of making it as they do.