Celts Agressively Shopping Rondo

[JYD]

http://espn.go.com/boston/nba/story/_/id/7631850/sources-boston-celtics-aggressively-trying-trade-guard-rajon-rondo

 

" The Boston Celtics are aggressively trying to trade Rajon Rondo, their fourth-leading scorer and one of the NBA's best point guards, sources told ESPN The Magazine's Chris Broussard. "

 

Where could you guys see him ending up? Do you think he'd be the same player even without great players around him (3 HOF in BOS)

[Warren2ThaG]

Give Mitch a call stupid idiot Ainge, weirdo guy.

[Real Deal]

http://i44.tinypic.com/1snwbr.jpg

 

Bye, Gasol! Thanks for the memories.

[Warren2ThaG]

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/regulator8534/Danny150.jpg

[Real Deal]

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/regulator8534/Danny150.jpg

Hahaha...I remember that.

[Need4Sheed]

http://images.cryhavok.org/d/18028-1/I+am+Monitoring+this+Thread.jpg

[ChosenOne]

Why would Boston trade trade their best player? Sounds [expletive]ing stupid to me lol

[Warren2ThaG]

Why would Boston trade trade their best player? Sounds [expletive]ing stupid to me lol

 

Ainge has a brain size of a peanut, lies a lot too bout trades.

Edited March 1, 2012 by Warren2ThaG

[Real Deal]

Why would Boston trade trade their best player? Sounds [expletive]ing stupid to me lol

1) Rondo and Rivers are having trouble seeing eye to eye.

 

2) Doc wants to coach his son next season, which will take the ball out of Rondo's hands.

 

3) Boston wants to make one more push for a title before they lose their big three, and they need a center, believing Bradley can step in and contribute at the point (a very good defensive PG).

 

C - Pau Gasol

PF - Kevin Garnett

SF - Paul Pierce

SG - Ray Allen

PG - Avery Bradley

 

I'm not sure if it's really THAT bad of an idea. Rondo is a stud and is young, but he may not be planning on staying, and they know this.

[Check my Stats]

Ainge should be fired immediately if he trades Rondo for Pau. They didn't wanna give Perk 7M a year, but they would be willing to pay a 31 year old 20M for the next 3 or 4? I wonder how many times KG would make Pau cry too. Pau is everything the Celtics aren't. I don't get how Rondo might not be staying, you do realize his contract has 4 more years on it right?

 

If they are trading Rondo (or anyone for that matter), you have to think it is in the same mold as the Jeff Green deal. Save money, and get younger. Not add money, get older, and get worse.

[Real Deal]

Ainge should be fired immediately if he trades Rondo for Pau. They didn't wanna give Perk 7M a year, but they would be willing to pay a 31 year old 20M for the next 3 or 4? I wonder how many times KG would make Pau cry too. Pau is everything the Celtics aren't. I don't get how Rondo might not be staying, you do realize his contract has 4 more years on it right?

If Rondo wants out of Boston, he won't have to wait four years. He'll ask for a trade, and I doubt Boston wants any part of that.

 

If they are trading Rondo (or anyone for that matter), you have to think it is in the same mold as the Jeff Green deal. Save money, and get younger. Not add money, get older, and get worse.

That really got them somewhere, didn't it?

 

-----------

 

Point is, Boston will in fact be losing their core all at the same time (or close to it). Garnett and Allen are expiring after this season. If they think they can go one more championship run, they will do it and risk the future by doing so. Gasol is not a primary scoring option, but you guys are underrating him more than I ever have.

 

There are some teams in this league that only care about championships. Today, Boston is not a contender. They are a sure-fire first round exit if they play Miami or Chicago...and right now, they are 8th and staring down a team that was in the Finals last season.

 

If Doc Rivers and the organization feel that Austin Rivers will be someone they can build around, instead of Rondo, they will take the chance now and try to win a championship this season, bank on Rivers and see where that road leads them. Otherwise, they will be picked apart in five or less games by the Heat or Bulls, go into next season with basically the same team (maybe losing Garnett and/or Allen), and still do nothing, with non-lottery picks...up until it's just Rondo.

 

It's "win now" in Boston, just like it is in Los Angeles.

[Mentch]

Maybe this is just me, but I really dont understand why they want to win now, their window is closed, they need to start rebuilding after this year and trading a young stud PG for a 31 year old PF is just a horrible horrible move

[Nitro]

This is one of the worst decisions I have ever seen.

 

Pau Gasol...really? I love his game, but Boston would have another 1-2 deals besides trading Rondo to have a shot at beating Chicago, Miami or OKC in a 7-game series. And even then, KG and Allen are likely gone this summer, and Pierce is only getting older. It'd be a huge gamble that won't immediately make them a true contender, and long-term it will completely cripple the franchise. Boston has NO young, impactful talent besides Rondo, who is already a top 5 PG in the NBA and his biggest weakness, jumpshooting, is one of the easiest things for a young player to correct. I LOVE Avery Bradley's defense, but he is absolutely putrid offensively. That is not the starting PG of a championship team, and is not a player you can build around in the future.

 

People really underrate Rondo because of his lack of jumpshot. Yes, he's benefited from having a HoF trio by his side, but he is an unbelievable ballhandler, playmaker, rebounder, defender and finisher at the rim. There are nights where he is by far the best player on the floor, and he's still so young and on a GREAT contract. Trading him would be so [expletive]ing stupid.

[Real Deal]

Just to clarify, I'm not saying the Celtics SHOULD trade Rondo. I'm just making sense of the trade. If Boston wants to get better TODAY, they trade Rondo for Gasol.

 

But...

 

That is not the starting PG of a championship team, and is not a player you can build around in the future.

So Derek Fisher is the exception? This is a guy who can't play defense, at all, and the only time he provides for us on offense is at the end of a game (in the clutch), and really, we wouldn't need him in the clutch if it wasn't for his horrible play for the other 3 1/2 quarters of the game.

[DunkinDerozan]

I don't think trading Pau for Rondo straight up makes the Celtics much better now, and it definitely makes them worse for the future. I suppose if they can guarantee that they're going to get Austin Rivers, than that makes it a it better. Even then, they should just be trading for a young player at another position considering they're going to need a PF, SF and SG all pretty soon.

[Nitro]

So Derek Fisher is the exception? This is a guy who can't play defense, at all, and the only time he provides for us on offense is at the end of a game (in the clutch), and really, we wouldn't need him in the clutch if it wasn't for his horrible play for the other 3 1/2 quarters of the game.

 

Fisher played in one of the few offenses that truly doesn't need a PG, and had at least 3 other players (4 when Bynum was healthy) who could create their own shot as well as shots for others...including arguably the best player in the league. At this point, KG is pretty much strictly a spot-up jumpshooter, Allen can't create off the dribble like he used to, and neither can Paul Pierce (who, against their primary competition, Miami, gets forced out of the high-post by LeBron, which is the only area Pierce can create from nowadays). Also, while Fisher is awful offensively, he was still a pretty consistent 3pt shooter and helped spacing. Bradley can't create offense and he's an awful jumpshooter who provides just as little spacing as Rondo does.

 

Also, the NBA is continuing to be a PG driven league, even more than just 2-3 seasons ago. Guys like CP3, Deron and Nash are still doing their thing, Westbrook and Rose have made massive strides and are now in the superstar realm (Rondo is right there too), and we have a new wave of talented PG's like Lawson, Lowry, Lin, Rubio, Wall, Holliday, Conely, Teague, Chalmers, etc... Even though he no longer is elite, Kidd's versatility allowed the Mavs to successfully get away with playing dangerous 2 PG lineups in the Finals that ended up burning the Heat defense, especially in the last few games of the series when the 3's started falling. If this was the Celtics of 2008 where the Big 3 were in their primes, and they had a bunch of very good veterans/young players who filled their roles perfectly, I'd say you can maybe get away with Bradley starting and playing a bunch of minutes. Now? I don't think so.

[SRT Spidey]

If they trade him. I will LOSE it. and thats putting it lightly, hate Ainge. Hes out of his mind lately since the championship season completely [expletive]ed the team. Very frustrating.

[Real Deal]

Fisher played in one of the few offenses that truly doesn't need a PG, and had at least 3 other players (4 when Bynum was healthy) who could create their own shot as well as shots for others...including arguably the best player in the league. At this point, KG is pretty much strictly a spot-up jumpshooter, Allen can't create off the dribble like he used to, and neither can Paul Pierce (who, against their primary competition, Miami, gets forced out of the high-post by LeBron, which is the only area Pierce can create from nowadays). Also, while Fisher is awful offensively, he was still a pretty consistent 3pt shooter and helped spacing. Bradley can't create offense and he's an awful jumpshooter who provides just as little spacing as Rondo does.

 

Also, the NBA is continuing to be a PG driven league, even more than just 2-3 seasons ago. Guys like CP3, Deron and Nash are still doing their thing, Westbrook and Rose have made massive strides and are now in the superstar realm (Rondo is right there too), and we have a new wave of talented PG's like Lawson, Lowry, Lin, Rubio, Wall, Holliday, Conely, Teague, Chalmers, etc... Even though he no longer is elite, Kidd's versatility allowed the Mavs to successfully get away with playing dangerous 2 PG lineups in the Finals that ended up burning the Heat defense, especially in the last few games of the series when the 3's started falling. If this was the Celtics of 2008 where the Big 3 were in their primes, and they had a bunch of very good veterans/young players who filled their roles perfectly, I'd say you can maybe get away with Bradley starting and playing a bunch of minutes. Now? I don't think so.

It's a PG-driven league, which is why Bradley would be good to have as your defensive PG, after Rondo's exit. Plus, I'm pretty sure Boston would also get Steve Blake in the deal, who may not be a great offensive PG, but he can still make the necessary passes and hit open shots here and there.

 

I don't see how a Gasol/KG/PP/RA/Blake team (with Bradley) would be as bad, or worse, than the current Celtics squad, who are dying for a big man right now.

[Nitro]

It's a PG-driven league, which is why Bradley would be good to have as your defensive PG, after Rondo's exit. Plus, I'm pretty sure Boston would also get Steve Blake in the deal, who may not be a great offensive PG, but he can still make the necessary passes and hit open shots here and there.

 

But Bradley doesn't offer any decent skills offensively, and won't give them the shot of athleticism/speed that this squad lacks even WITH Rondo. OKC and Miami run laps around them, and even the Bulls to an extent. Rondo is the one who gives them some explosiveness on offense, helps get them easy shots for himself and for trailers on the fastbreak, is the only guy who can consistently attack the rim from the perimeter, and offers versatility when it comes to rebounding and defense. Gasol will help them on the boards and in the post, but they'd have the same issue the Lakers have right now, which is lack of perimeter players who can get out on the fastbreak as well as attack the rim in the halfcourt set.

[Real Deal]

But Bradley doesn't offer any decent skills offensively, and won't give them the shot of athleticism/speed that this squad lacks even WITH Rondo. OKC and Miami run laps around them, and even the Bulls to an extent. Rondo is the one who gives them some explosiveness on offense, helps get them easy shots for himself and for trailers on the fastbreak, is the only guy who can consistently attack the rim from the perimeter, and offers versatility when it comes to rebounding and defense. Gasol will help them on the boards and in the post, but they'd have the same issue the Lakers have right now, which is lack of perimeter players who can get out on the fastbreak as well as attack the rim in the halfcourt set.

The Lakers didn't need perimeter players attacking the rim back in 2010. If you give me Shannon Brown...come on, dude. Kobe was settling for jumpers, Ron Artest wasn't doing anything...I'm not really sure what else there is to say regarding that situation. This CURRENT Lakers team has much more problems than that.

 

Dallas didn't need youth to beat Miami in the Finals. They made a defensive stand...kept the Heat under 100 almost every game, four of those six were low-scoring games to begin with. Barea had a couple of good games, played horrible in the other four. Dirk, Terry, Marion, Kidd, Peja...all in their 30's and not able to "keep up" with teams like the Heat, Bulls and Thunder...but they did, in a different way.

 

I think you're underestimating what a post player, one that passes the ball very well, can do for the Celtics. If there's no Andrew Bynum, or another seven-footer that is taking up the paint, Gasol will take over the low post...and while I think Miami would still get to the Finals, I wouldn't be surprised to see a series like that go seven.

 

Otherwise, Boston will just see a sweep, or a five-gamer, possibly lose two of their veterans, and run with Rondo and Pierce until #34 retires. Boston is not NY or LA...free agents aren't dying to play there, so it will all depend on the draft, either way you flip the coin.

 

A team like Boston would rather go for it all in the limited time they have, than to see themselves eliminated in the first or second round of the playoffs for years to come.

[Nitro]

The Lakers didn't need perimeter players attacking the rim back in 2010. If you give me Shannon Brown...come on, dude. Kobe was settling for jumpers, Ron Artest wasn't doing anything...I'm not really sure what else there is to say regarding that situation. This CURRENT Lakers team has much more problems than that.

 

The league is different than it was 2 years ago. OKC gave the Lakers all they could handle that year, Utah was a bad matchup, that Phoenix team had many flaws, and they got lucky being matched with an equally slow, aging team in Boston. Miami, Chicago and this year's OKC team are much different animals, and all 3 would beat that Lakers squad in a 7 game series IMO.

 

Dallas didn't need youth to beat Miami in the Finals. They made a defensive stand...kept the Heat under 100 almost every game, four of those six were low-scoring games to begin with. Barea had a couple of good games, played horrible in the other four. Dirk, Terry, Marion, Kidd, Peja...all in their 30's and not able to "keep up" with teams like the Heat, Bulls and Thunder...but they did, in a different way.

 

Dallas made a defensive stand, but they also tore up the Miami defense the last few games of the series with PnR's from multiple players which created penetration, and then knock-down 3pt shooters. Kidd's versatility allowed the Mavs to play a 2 PG lineup much of the series, with both backcourt players being very effective PnR players. As much as they were containing Miami through the first 4 games, Miami was doing the same to them. What opened up the series was penetration from the PnR, and it allowed the Kidd/Terry/Barea combo to shoot 10-15 from 3 in Game 5, and 7-13 from 3 in Game 6. That was the difference in the series. What also made it effective was they were running that PnR with Dirk and Chandler, two of the most dangerous PnR big men in the entire league.

 

Boston, without Rondo and with Gasol, wouldn't have those same advantages. Bradley, Allen and Pierce can't attack the rim off PnR's, neither Gasol or KG have 3pt range, and neither of them are serious threats actually rolling to the basket. If you don't have that threat in the PnR, and if none of your perimeter players can get to the rim off iso situations/on the fastbreak, then you will have a pretty ugly offense.

 

I think you're underestimating what a post player, one that passes the ball very well, can do for the Celtics. If there's no Andrew Bynum, or another seven-footer that is taking up the paint, Gasol will take over the low post...and while I think Miami would still get to the Finals, I wouldn't be surprised to see a series like that go seven.

 

Woah...just a few weeks ago you were saying it didn't matter if Bynum was playing, that Gasol won't get in the post no matter who he's playing with, or whatever his coach tells him. Which is it?

 

And I think you are severely underestimating the impact of perimeter players who can attack the paint, either in the halfcourt of fastbreak. The top teams in the league are explosive, young and athletic, and most of those teams are capable of adequately defending a Pau Gasol or KG, and two of those teams (Chicago and Miami) have strong defensive SF's who can throw Boston's only serious perimeter iso threat out of his comfort zone. Boston needs that extra perimeter threat to open up the offense.

 

Otherwise, Boston will just see a sweep, or a five-gamer, possibly lose two of their veterans, and run with Rondo and Pierce until #34 retires. Boston is not NY or LA...free agents aren't dying to play there, so it will all depend on the draft, either way you flip the coin.

 

A team like Boston would rather go for it all in the limited time they have, than to see themselves eliminated in the first or second round of the playoffs for years to come.

 

A Rondo for Gasol swap doesn't make them significantly better than they are now, and they'd still be major underdogs against Chicago or Miami unless they made a few other big trades.

 

And if they give up Rondo, who IS a top 5 PG currently with a lot of potential, they have NO young prospects to build around or trade in the near-future. This Gasol experiment could leave them only a half-year window to succeed, with KG and Allen being free agents in the summer (and continuing to decline), and Pierce also aging and not getting any better. And there is no one out there who would give Boston a series shot at winning the title with Gasol, so trading their only young player with value would make no sense whatsoever.

[Flash]

How does Gasol make this team better than Rondo woud? That makes absolutely 0 sense. It doesn't make them better now and not ever.

 

If they're smart they'll try and get rid of one of the big 3. I'm sure you could get solid value for KG. Rondo isn't the guy who needs to go.

 

And the Austin Rivers thing would completely eliminate the Lakers from contention you realize that right?