Can the Oklahoma City Thunder become a dynasty?

[Real Deal]

BEFORE they win their first championship (because it's much more difficult to stick your neck out there at this time), do you think the Thunder can be the next dynasty in the NBA?

 

Durant - 23 years old

Westbrook - 23 years old

Harden - 22 years old

Ibaka - 22 years old

 

Duncan won his first NBA championship at 23 years old. Manu was 25, and I believe Parker was 20 or 21. Just putting it out there.

[kingfish]

No for a few reasons.

 

1) They probably wont be able to keep all four of those guys long term. Harden and Ibaka wont get max contracts but theyll get something close to it most likely.

 

2) There are too many other stars in the league to form another "super team." Only a matter of time before another one forms and one that is actually formidable that doesnt have two star players with the same play style.

 

3) They play in the Western Conference. Kobe and the Lakers are still relevant. They might have won in 5 but truthfully we basically gave them wins in games 2 and 4 by turning the ball over and blowing a lead late in the game. Were still one move away from being the best team in the NBA again so long as Kobe is healthy.

[Blazed49]

I think it'll depend on if they can keep serge AND harden. I'm not sure how their cap is but if they can keep both then absolutely. That's a great and very young core. They really could become the next spurs. Scary to think especially since they're in our division. :-/

[Check my Stats]

I think it is going to depend on a few things.

 

1. Westbrook's ego. If this kid can stay in check and realize KD is the franchise, that'll go a long way. Also, if he resists Harden becoming their 2nd best player (he will be, if he already isn't) it could also hurt this team.

 

2. What they do with their cap. I don't buy that they will have to choose between RW and Harden. I think they can keep all 3, but it is going to come at the expense of their depth. Their GM is a stud though so if he can pluck solid rotation players late in the draft (ala the Spurs) they should be okay. He can't afford any more gaffes like the Perkins contract though, or they WILL lose one of their big 3. Not to mention Durant really does seem like a guy who would take a paycut 3 years down the line to keep this team competitive. Idk. I think they can keep all 4 (Ibaka) for at least a couple more years... they won't run into problems until the contracts have increased a few years down the road.

 

3. How the Heat wind up. They are still the only team I see as a threat to stop the Thunder from winning 4 titles in the next 7 years or something like that. Obviously a lot can change and the NBA is incredibly competitive these days, but in the immediate future, I don't see anyone else other than Miami on a year in year out basis.

 

Also, it depends what you mean by dynasty. A dynasty like the Spurs? Of course, I think the Thunder would be somewhat disappointed with less than 4 titles in 10 years with this core (depending on who they can hold onto). If you mean something like 3 titles in 4 years, or 4 in 5, or even 3 in 5... I just don't know, The NBA is insane and with the attitude superstars have these days, who knows how long until a new 'super team' for lack of a better word is formed.

 

I think if they can keep their main 3, they should be contending for the championship for the next decade.

Edited June 7, 2012 by Check my Stats

[Make It Naaaashty]

It can happen but it's gonna be hard financially. Guys like Harden and Ibaka are going to want more money because other teams will be willing to pay them the big bucks. But with teams like the Heat, Bulls, and a couple teams in the West it's going to be very difficult for OKC to win multiple championships. It's also not a given that the team is going to be healthy every season.

[Warren2ThaG]

yes, esp' reaching finals, West isnt that good.

[CaliCurbStomppa]

Yeah but it depends if they can keep some of these guys

[ChosenOne]

For some reason i think Harden and Iblocka are going to fallow in Durant footsteps and do whats good for the team. I dont think they will move on for a couple million. Yes this team is going to run shit this decade.

[AboveLegit]

I'd be shocked is Presti didn't manage the cap space in a way that allows them to keep both Harden and Ibaka. They can always amnesty Perkins which should take $25mill off the books, and depending on what the salary cap is in 2 years, I wouldn't be shocked if the front office is willing to pay off the luxury tax.

 

Regardless of that, this team, led by Durant, can be a dynasty. I actually think they're already ahead of schedule, I didn't expect them to reach the Finals this year, and based off KD's development, it's safe to say he could be the best player in the league in a year or two.

 

It's funny, Tim Duncan led the Spurs to a title in a lockout year back when he was 23 years old, and now KD is doing the same.

Edited June 8, 2012 by AboveLegit

[DunkinDerozan]

I think Ibaka, Durant and Harden shouldn't be a problem getting them to stick around together. Its Westbrook who could end up leaving IMO. Like what kingfish said, Durant is already by far best player on the team, and I don't think Harden is that far off of being second best. I don't know what Westbrooks ego is like, but if its anything like his playing style, he might get pissy about being third scoring option and leave after his contract is up or even demand a trade.

[JYD]

No.

 

How can they afford Durant, Westbrook, Harden, Ibaka? They need all those guys for sure to get to where they are...that's not even mentioning Perkins and Seflosha who are very very valuable.

[ChosenOne]

I think Ibaka, Durant and Harden shouldn't be a problem getting them to stick around together. Its Westbrook who could end up leaving IMO. Like what kingfish said, Durant is already by far best player on the team, and I don't think Harden is that far off of being second best. I don't know what Westbrooks ego is like, but if its anything like his playing style, he might get pissy about being third scoring option and leave after his contract is up or even demand a trade.

 

If i remember correctly Westbrook already has signed a 6 year 80 million dollar extension.

[Nitro]

It's surprising to me that Westbrook is still getting so much hate. He just had an incredible season, raised his efficiency, and his explosiveness at the PG position is nearly as important as what Durant does for this team (not saying he's as good individually as Durant).

 

Anyway, I made a topic at the beginning of the season about their cap situation, and it's even a bigger issue now after the seasons Harden and Ibaka had. If Rudy Gay could get a max contract, I think Harden could, or at least something close to it from a small market team. Per 36min, Ibaka averaged 12PPG/10RPG and an amazing 4.8BPG. Of all the young guns for OKC, he is the guy with the most untapped potential, and I could easily see him getting $11-13M per year. With Durant/Westbrook having max contracts, Harden possibly requiring a max deal, and Ibaka likely getting over $10M a year, and Perkins getting $7-8M (I believe), they are going to have to cut ties with 1, maybe 2 of those players, and will be in a similar cap situation that the Heat have been in since the Big 3 formed.

 

However, with the core 2 to build around, they will be a contender for a very long time, with the chance of being a dynasty if management is smart.

[Check my Stats]

I'd be shocked is Presti didn't manage the cap space in a way that allows them to keep both Harden and Ibaka. They can always amnesty Perkins which should take $25mill off the books, and depending on what the salary cap is in 2 years, I wouldn't be shocked if the front office is willing to pay off the luxury tax.

 

Regardless of that, this team, led by Durant, can be a dynasty. I actually think they're already ahead of schedule, I didn't expect them to reach the Finals this year, and based off KD's development, it's safe to say he could be the best player in the league in a year or two.

 

It's funny, Tim Duncan led the Spurs to a title in a lockout year back when he was 23 years old, and now KD is doing the same.

 

Unless LBJ is retiring, I don't see how this can be the case.

[AboveLegit]

Unless LBJ is retiring, I don't see how this can be the case.

I've had the same logic for a while now (LeBron being the clear cut best player), but I've become more and more convinced that KD is closing the gap. The way he's been closing out games in the playoffs is nothing short of incredible, his play making is also very good now as well as his defense. Time will tell, but I think he's on his way.

[Sħãlïq™]

Yes, but it depends mainly on:

 

1) The future of Harden and Ibaka;

 

2) Kobe's health;

 

3) Mitch Kupchak's moves.

[EastCoastNiner]

No, because they will have to get by the Heat for years to come, and that will not be happening.

 

LeBron>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Durant.

 

 

We'll see if the Heat win their current series though.

[Check my Stats]

I've had the same logic for a while now (LeBron being the clear cut best player), but I've become more and more convinced that KD is closing the gap. The way he's been closing out games in the playoffs is nothing short of incredible, his play making is also very good now as well as his defense. Time will tell, but I think he's on his way.

 

Durant is one dimensional. He is like what Melo could have been with a good head on his shoulders. No matter how incredibly good he is at that one dimension (even better than LeBron) he doesn't come close to LeBron in all the other areas, and likely never will. By LeBron's 5th year he was already the best player in the NBA, and Durant is still so far behind defensively, and intangibly. Not to mention, while Durant has a more impressive offensive arsenal, LeBron is still the more effective scorer (not better, effective).

 

Aside from a few small things, Durant is still basically the same player he has been the past 2 seasons. Sure he is clutch as hell and I give him that, but the reason the Thunder are progressing has as much to do with the supporting cast, actually probably more so, as it does to do with him.

 

His defense and playmaking are average at best. I know people might give me the old "you need to watch the games", but I watch plenty of him. I think his playmaking is better than some give him credit for, but he still turned it over more than ever this year (4 times a game), though I will admit he has been much improved these playoffs, which I give him credit for.

 

Basically, if Durant goes 6-20 what is he doing for you team? The answer is that he is doing a hell of a lot less than LeBron if LeBron shoots 6-20.

[AboveLegit]

Durant is one dimensional. He is like what Melo could have been with a good head on his shoulders. No matter how incredibly good he is at that one dimension (even better than LeBron) he doesn't come close to LeBron in all the other areas, and likely never will. By LeBron's 5th year he was already the best player in the NBA, and Durant is still so far behind defensively, and intangibly. Not to mention, while Durant has a more impressive offensive arsenal, LeBron is still the more effective scorer (not better, effective).

 

Aside from a few small things, Durant is still basically the same player he has been the past 2 seasons. Sure he is clutch as hell and I give him that, but the reason the Thunder are progressing has as much to do with the supporting cast, actually probably more so, as it does to do with him.

 

His defense and playmaking are average at best. I know people might give me the old "you need to watch the games", but I watch plenty of him. I think his playmaking is better than some give him credit for, but he still turned it over more than ever this year (4 times a game), though I will admit he has been much improved these playoffs, which I give him credit for.

 

Basically, if Durant goes 6-20 what is he doing for you team? The answer is that he is doing a hell of a lot less than LeBron if LeBron shoots 6-20.

Oh LeBron is absolutely the best player now, and definitely much more well rounded than Durant, but I do believe at the rate KD is improving, he could be better in a year or two.

 

I think you're highly underestimating how much Durant has improved from the past 2 seasons.

 

And KD turns it over just as much as LeBron does per game. How do you figure LeBron is the more effective scorer? Sure he posts a higher FG%, but Durant is still deadly efficient scoring the ball, gets to the FT line the same amount as LBJ, and makes 86% of them, while Bron makes 77%. Simply put, on a given basis, you'd have to take more away from Durant than you would for LBJ if you plan on stopping them from scoring.

 

Far too often we have a hard time distinguishing the best player from the most complete player. Durant doesn't have to average 8apg for him to be better than LeBron. If he continues this offensive onslaught he's putting on the league year in and year out, and works on his play making and defense, he has the chance to be better than LeBron, who's also more susceptible to declining as he continues to age.

[Nitro]

Not to mention, while Durant has a more impressive offensive arsenal, LeBron is still the more effective scorer (not better, effective).

 

LeBron isn't the more effective scorer. Durant has had a higher TS% 2 of the last 3 seasons, and has scored at slightly greater volume each of those seasons. Where as LeBron generally needs the ball in iso/pick-and-roll situations to get an efficient shot off, Durant can do that as well as be one of the most lethal catch-and-shoot players in the NBA. And having more tricks in your bag does make you more effective as long as you do it efficiently as Durant does...it helps you counter whatever type of defense is thrown at you. Having those extra tricks also makes Durant the easier player to build around offensively because he can be an efficient 30PPG scorer in a system where he has to create his own shot, or a system where his sidekick absolutely needs the ball in his hands constantly to be effective (which is what Westbrook requires). As a scorer, I believe Durant could do what LeBron did in Cleveland, but I don't think Bron could do what Durant is doing in OKC with Westbrook playing the way he does. Wade changed his style immensely and yet there still is a chemistry issue between he and Bron. With Durant those problems would be non-existent.

 

As an overall player, I don't think KD will ever be better than LeBron has been the last 3 years, and I don't think that will change for another 3-4 years. However, Durant does have the capability to do so, physically and mentally. With his size, length and athleticism, he can become an extremely dangerous player defensively...I envision him becoming the SF version of Kevin Garnett on that side of the ball. He could become devastating defending the PnR, closing out on 3pt shooters, cutting off passing lanes, and altering shots off and on ball due to his length. Remember, LeBron didn't become a great defender until around the 2008 Olympics, and it all had to do with effort and learning how to use his physical tools to his advantage. With Durant's dedication to improving his game and a solid defensive coach in Scott Brooks, I feel he can make similar strides.

 

Durant cracked 8RPG this season, something Bron has never done, and there is no reason to believe he can't improve that even more. The huge area Durant will never come close to Bron in is ballhandling/playmaking...that is something that you either have, or you don't. However, Durant has made HUGE strides in this area, even if stats don't reflect it. With Westbook needing the ball so much to be effective and Durant being so good playing off-ball, he's never going to be a big assist guy, and it would hurt the team if he did take a bigger role in that area. However, his ability to find open teammates off dribble drives and in the PnR has imrpoved immensely, as has the accuracy and strength of those passes. This has to do with an increased comfort level playing in the NBA and learning how to counter every defense the opposition throws at him. This area of his game will continue to improve, but he'll never be even half of what LeBron is there.

 

Overall, I was kinda hard on Durant his first few seasons, but he has truly become a superstar of the highest caliber, and his game is rounding itself out as each year passes. I don't think he'll ever be better than LeBron is right now (which is top 10 all-time level, easily), but he's going to be unbelievable and a top 3 player for many years to come.

[Flash]

I don't see any way they keep all 4. Harden is getting a max deal when his contract is up, without a doubt and you know someone is going to overpay for Serge and give him a near max contract.

[moeroadkill]

I don't see any way they keep all 4. Harden is getting a max deal when his contract is up, without a doubt and you know someone is going to overpay for Serge and give him a near max contract.

they could use their amnesty on perk and going into the tax is always an option

but i wouldn't be surprised if harden and ibaka take a pay cut to stay together. i have no doubt pesti and bennett have something up theirsleeve to keep this team together