2012 ESPN Rank

[Check my Stats]

1. LeBron

2. Kevin Durant

3. Dwight

4. Chris Paul

5. Derrick Rose

6. Kobe

7. Kevin Love

8. Dwyane Wade

9. Russell Westbrook

10. Deron Williams

11. Dirk

12. Rondo

13. Bynum

14. Blake

15. Gasol

16. Tony Parker

17. Melo

18. Chris Bosh

19. Steve Nash

20. Aldridge

 

Thoughts? I actually think that they did a surprisingly really solid job this year. I think the top 10 is pretty much perfect (tried to think of any reason possible to kick Love out of the top 10, but couldn't find one) in terms of those guys all being the top 10, the order could probably be fixed a bit; ie- put Dwight 2 where he belongs, Wade should be top 5, Deron moved up.. I'd probably move Rose down... we're not talking about a sprained knee, we're talking reconstructive surgery... people did the same shit with Wade when he blew his shoulder out. But at that point I feel almost like I am nitpicking.

 

Post what you would change, and who you think got shafted out of the top 20 (Manu???)

Edited September 27, 2012 by Check my Stats

[Flash]

lol @ Derrick Rose being number 5 and Love over Wade

Edited September 27, 2012 by Flash

[Real Deal]

Kobe is still in the five. Can't put Rose in there.

 

And Love can't be over Wade or Williams, and Westbrook can't be over D-Will, either.

 

I don't get how primary options can be tossed aside like that. Westbrook has yet to prove he can lead a team to anything, anywhere, as a primary scorer...so as an all-star and NOT a legitimate superstar OR a proven franchise player, why does he fall in front of Williams?

[Flash]

I'd go:

 

1. LeBron

2. KD

3. CP3

4. Dwight

5. Bean

6. Wade (could very well go back to top 5 if he's healthy)

7. D-Will

8. Love

 

After that you can go anyway you want, even have Rose at 9 if you want but at this point, with a torn ACL I don't see how he's better than Westbrook, Rondo or Parker.

[ChosenOne]

My Top 10 List

 

1. LeBron

2. Durant

3. Dwight

4. CP3

5. Kobe

6. Wade

7. Love

8. Williams

9. Westbrook

10. Rose

[Check my Stats]

I'd go:

 

1. LeBron

2. KD

3. CP3

4. Dwight

5. Bean

6. Wade (could very well go back to top 5 if he's healthy)

7. D-Will

8. Love

 

After that you can go anyway you want, even have Rose at 9 if you want but at this point, with a torn ACL I don't see how he's better than Westbrook, Rondo or Parker.

 

Durant AND Paul over Dwight? Ridiculous. Chris Paul is my favourite player in the league and he isn't close to Dwight (we're not talking about 08 Chris Paul). Dwight should be 2nd, its not even really close for me (and I don't say this lightly, as I hate him). Stick Durant on those Magic teams and how many games are they winning? Are they even getting home court in the playoffs? Probably not.

Edited September 27, 2012 by Check my Stats

[ballorama]

If these rankings are based on last season.. I dont see how Dwight and Rose are in the top five to be honest.

 

1) LBJ

2) Durant

3) Kobe

4) CP3

5) Wade

6) Dwight

7) Rose

8) Love

9) Williams

10) Westbrook

[AboveLegit]

I don't get how primary options can be tossed aside like that. Westbrook has yet to prove he can lead a team to anything, anywhere, as a primary scorer...so as an all-star and NOT a legitimate superstar OR a proven franchise player, why does he fall in front of Williams?

Why does his role matter so much in rankings like this? All that really has to be mentioned is that Westbrook significantly outplayed Williams last year, and for the majority of the season, played like the best PG in the game.

 

I had this discussion with iMan on twitter a few days ago, I'd probably slot Melo right at 20, and move Aldridge slightly ahead of Bosh.

 

ESPN rank is largely based off last year (not entirely, but a good amount), so with that in mind, I'll post my list:

 

1. LeBron

2. Kevin Durant

3. CP3

4. Dwight

5. Wade

6. Love

7. Westbrook

8. Kobe

9. Derrick Rose

10. Rondo

11. Bynum

12. Blake

13. Tony Parker

14. Dirk

15. Deron Williams

16. Gasol

17. Aldridge

18. Chris Bosh

19. Steve Nash

20. Melo

 

I'm not overly impressed with Kobe, I think he had a down year last season, so I really can't bump his ranking up from 1 year ago when he was ranked #7. I know you can attribute his struggles to the wretched offense ran last year, but no matter how you slice it, I don't see how you can put him over guys like Westbrook or Love who had career years.

 

Same goes for Deron Williams who somehow managed to fall only 1 slot since last years' ranking. Rondo clearly had the better year, as did Blake (no matter how much people think he's overrated, his production was still up), Bynum, and Tony Parker (who for much of the season was playing like an MVP candidate).

 

I understand situations are different for every player, Deron had an awful supporting cast and had to shoulder the load, but there's no excuse for his TS% to drop that much and still be given the benefit of the doubt.

 

Obviously if healthy, the list changes some (i.e. Dwight goes to #2), but overall I feel pretty comfortable posting this list.

[DunkinDerozan]

1. LeBron

2. Kevin Durant

3. Dwight

4. Chris Paul

5. Derrick Rose

6. Kobe

7. Kevin Love

8. Dwyane Wade

9. Russell Westbrook

10. Deron Williams

11. Dirk

12. Rondo

13. Bynum

14. Blake

15. Gasol

16. Tony Parker

17. Melo

18. Chris Bosh

19. Steve Nash

20. Aldridge

 

 

For the most part I think its a pretty accurate list. I'd put Kobe over Rose for now though. Aldridge and Bosh is pretty close too, I'd maybe put Aldrdge ahead of Bosh.

[Real Deal]

Why does his role matter so much in rankings like this? All that really has to be mentioned is that Westbrook significantly outplayed Williams last year, and for the majority of the season, played like the best PG in the game.

 

I had this discussion with iMan on twitter a few days ago, I'd probably slot Melo right at 20, and move Aldridge slightly ahead of Bosh.

 

ESPN rank is largely based off last year (not entirely, but a good amount), so with that in mind, I'll post my list:

 

1. LeBron

2. Kevin Durant

3. CP3

4. Dwight

5. Wade

6. Love

7. Westbrook

8. Kobe

9. Derrick Rose

10. Rondo

11. Bynum

12. Blake

13. Tony Parker

14. Dirk

15. Deron Williams

16. Gasol

17. Aldridge

18. Chris Bosh

19. Steve Nash

20. Melo

 

I'm not overly impressed with Kobe, I think he had a down year last season, so I really can't bump his ranking up from 1 year ago when he was ranked #7. I know you can attribute his struggles to the wretched offense ran last year, but no matter how you slice it, I don't see how you can put him over guys like Westbrook or Love who had career years.

 

Same goes for Deron Williams who somehow managed to fall only 1 slot since last years' ranking. Rondo clearly had the better year, as did Blake (no matter how much people think he's overrated, his production was still up), Bynum, and Tony Parker (who for much of the season was playing like an MVP candidate).

 

I understand situations are different for every player, Deron had an awful supporting cast and had to shoulder the load, but there's no excuse for his TS% to drop that much and still be given the benefit of the doubt.

 

Obviously if healthy, the list changes some (i.e. Dwight goes to #2), but overall I feel pretty comfortable posting this list.

If a player's role isn't going to make much of a difference, why should their team success matter? You're penalizing Deron Williams because the Nets were a bad team, basically...but you and I both know Westbrook is no D-Will. When Williams had legitimate teammates that WERE NOT superstars (like Durant), he was able to lead Utah to the WCF.

 

There is most definitely an excuse as to why Williams' TS% dropped. He didn't have a supporting cast, period. Do you expect Andrew Bynum to be more efficient in Philadelphia? What happened to Odom's efficiency, and overall play, when he was in a Lakers jersey? Williams was shooting more threes than ever (I believe highest of his career), and he was playing more like a scoring PG with little passing abilities, and that's very easy to defend unless you're someone like Rose or Westbrook (and both of them have teammates who can take the load off of them at any given time, especially Russ).

 

Rose is also ahead of Westbrook...so unless you're giving him a kick down to the very bottom half of that ten because of injuries, I can't agree with Russ over him, either.

 

In the NBA, you have to prove yourself to be somebody. Westbrook has proven he can be a viable second option on a legitimate contender, possible championship team (and that's just an assumption, as they lost to Miami). Rose is a former MVP and a primary scoring option that also ran the offense in a 60-win Chicago team. D-Will had a similar role with his Utah teams, although he had a bit more help on offense than Rose (and I don't like saying Boozer was the man, because Williams did a lot of spoon-feeding and creating).

 

I won't even dip into the Kobe/Westbrook debate. It will be me repeating what I said above, and while Kobe has indeed lost a step, he's still the better overall player. Westbrook can't hold his jock right now.

 

I'll put it this way: you eliminate Perkins and the P&R from the equation, stick Kobe on Westbrook...and suddenly, Russ is shut down. Thank God for Durant, though...and that's the difference between a superstar and an all-star caliber second option (similar to the difference between an all-star in Westbrook, and a sixth-man and borderline all-star in Harden). A big difference. The Thunder would not be able to function for a full 82 games and postseason if their roles were reversed.

 

In 1999-2000, Kobe was more Westbrook than Durant (alongside Shaq). Eventually, he became a superstar, and it led to a nasty run of games where he completely dominated when Shaq would struggle, sit the bench in foul trouble, or when O'Neal was out there with him...didn't matter. He would rack up his nine-consecutive 40+ point games, 7-2 record (Shaq in just two of those games), 13-consecutive 35+ point games, etc. It all started in 2001, second championship run.

 

We have yet to see Westbrook turn himself into a superstar...and it can be done with Durant as his teammate, too. Even if you want to argue that Durant could be holding him back, there's still no proof that Westbrook can do what Rose, Williams or Kobe have been able to (even today) as a primary option, and that's a big reason why he's not going to reach that plateau in my rankings.

 

It's also the same reason why Andrew Bynum isn't in my top ten. He's the second best big man in the NBA, but because he was a second option in LA, I have no reason to put him over most of the primary options and true, legitimate franchise players.

 

---------

 

EDIT: I also know you don't think Love is a better player than Kobe. Come on. Love was inefficient for a big man, plays very little defense, struggled greatly without Rubio, and is a poor man's Dirk (but a better rebounder). No way. Having a career year doesn't mean you give them an extra boost on the list, or else you would have ranked Drew higher.

[Built Ford Tough]

For the most part I think its a pretty accurate list. I'd put Kobe over Rose for now though. Aldridge and Bosh is pretty close too, I'd maybe put Aldrdge ahead of Bosh.

 

I'd probably as well if this is based on production, but I fully believe that Bosh is a better player than Aldridge is.

 

I've mentioned this plenty of times on here, but I think that Bosh has become one of the more underrated players in the league since he joined up with Wade and James in Miami. He was a top 10 player in the league his final season with Toronto and was routinely a top 15 player every other year of his Toronto prime and it seems like people forget how good he actually is.

 

As number one options on their respective teams, Bosh was more productive than Aldridge:

 

Aldridge - 21.8 ppg, 8.5 rpg, 2.2 apg, 1 bpg with a 21.9 PER and 55 TS%

Bosh - 22.8 ppg, 9.9 rpg, 2.5 apg, 1.1 bpg with a 23.2 PER and 58 TS%

 

I'm actually pleasently surprised that Bosh was included in the top 20 due to his relatively small role on the Heat, at least in regards to all the other players on the list.

[AboveLegit]

You're penalizing Deron Williams because the Nets were a bad team, basically....

No, I'm penalizing Deron Williams for not playing like the Deron Williams we're all used to seeing. And let's stop kidding ourselves, we can't use the cliche "he has a bad team" phrase to cover up his lapses. He just didn't play efficient basketball last year, and while we can give the occasional "he has bad teammates" excuse every once and a while, let's not make a habit of it. He turned the ball over a lot (as did Westbrook, mind you), he took a lot of bad shots, didn't drive to the basket nearly enough, displayed terrible body language, etc, he simply didn't perform up to his standards, and for that, I'll penalize him.

 

What I think most are failing to realize here is that this is mostly based off last year. ESPN does this every year, hence why they show the arrows symbolizing who ascended or descended since the previous season. Now, if you're talking strictly ability here, sure guys like Deron, Dirk, and Kobe would be higher, but since they had off years (to their standards), they should prolapse a bit.

 

Rose is also ahead of Westbrook...so unless you're giving him a kick down to the very bottom half of that ten because of injuries, I can't agree with Russ over him, either.

Name me another PG other than CP3 who had a better year than Russ last year. You can't.

 

I won't even dip into the Kobe/Westbrook debate. It will be me repeating what I said above, and while Kobe has indeed lost a step, he's still the better overall player. Westbrook can't hold his jock right now.

Can't hold his jock right now? If we dive into statistics, Westbrook beats him out in almost every offensive category. Kobe doesn't even come close to him on defense, and hell, even the clutch stats favor Westbrook.

 

Kobe simply had a bad year last season. There's no other way to put it. Westbrook played lights out.

 

I'll put it this way: you eliminate Perkins and the P&R from the equation, stick Kobe on Westbrook...and suddenly, Russ is shut down. Thank God for Durant, though...and that's the difference between a superstar and an all-star caliber second option (similar to the difference between an all-star in Westbrook, and a sixth-man and borderline all-star in Harden). A big difference. The Thunder would not be able to function for a full 82 games and postseason if their roles were reversed.

And you don't think that's at all going to effect Durant's game? So if we eliminate that, Durant's production falls because he has no one slashing to the hoop, no one to set those off ball screens, and no one to kick the ball out to him for easy buckets. The argument goes both ways, Durant needs Westbrook, maybe not as much, but still enough for him not to be considered the 2nd best player in the league.

 

So are you arguing the same for Durant? Because of the offense he's under, should we place Kobe ahead of him? One on one is Kobe's bread and butter, that's simply not the case for Russ or Durant.

 

We have yet to see Westbrook turn himself into a superstar...and it can be done with Durant as his teammate, too. Even if you want to argue that Durant could be holding him back, there's still no proof that Westbrook can do what Rose, Williams or Kobe have been able to (even today) as a primary option, and that's a big reason why he's not going to reach that plateau in my rankings.

So because of his role on the team (a role which he's subjected to by the way because he has the 2nd best player in the world by his side), you ignore the production advantage he has over the likes of Kobe, Rose, and Williams? Despite how inefficient Kobe and Williams were last year, you refuse to place Westbrook over them? Let's not forget how much better a defender Russ is than the aforementioned players...

 

EDIT: I also know you don't think Love is a better player than Kobe. Come on. Love was inefficient for a big man, plays very little defense, struggled greatly without Rubio, and is a poor man's Dirk (but a better rebounder). No way. Having a career year doesn't mean you give them an extra boost on the list, or else you would have ranked Drew higher.

Love being a big man shouldn't excuse his inefficiency because he doesn't play a prototypical big man game. And he had a much, much better year than Dirk, he shot the ball at a better clip, his efficiency was higher, as was his PER... and this was all happening with a bad supporting cast.

 

Struggled without Rubio? That's hardly the case. He still managed to average roughly 26PPG (including a 51 and 40 pt game), which is right at his season average. What he had trouble with was the pick and roll game, which naturally became an issue once Rubio went down.

 

His defense is an obvious concern, I can't cover that up, but his production on the floor trumps Kobe's greatly, which is the reasoning behind why he's ranked higher.

[Real Deal]

So just answer this one question: is Kevin Love a better basketball player than Kobe Bryant? Simple yes or no.

[NomarFachix]

I'd probably as well if this is based on production, but I fully believe that Bosh is a better player than Aldridge is.

 

I've mentioned this plenty of times on here, but I think that Bosh has become one of the more underrated players in the league since he joined up with Wade and James in Miami. He was a top 10 player in the league his final season with Toronto and was routinely a top 15 player every other year of his Toronto prime and it seems like people forget how good he actually is.

 

As number one options on their respective teams, Bosh was more productive than Aldridge:

 

Aldridge - 21.8 ppg, 8.5 rpg, 2.2 apg, 1 bpg with a 21.9 PER and 55 TS%

Bosh - 22.8 ppg, 9.9 rpg, 2.5 apg, 1.1 bpg with a 23.2 PER and 58 TS%

 

I'm actually pleasently surprised that Bosh was included in the top 20 due to his relatively small role on the Heat, at least in regards to all the other players on the list.

The last time Bosh dominated the ball as much as Aldridge did last year he put up 24 and 11. I agree with you, can't drop him below Aldridge because of role. He's still the better player.

Edited September 28, 2012 by iMan

[NomarFachix]

So just answer this one question: is Kevin Love a better basketball player than Kobe Bryant? Simple yes or no.

[Real Deal]

[DunkinDerozan]

I'd probably as well if this is based on production, but I fully believe that Bosh is a better player than Aldridge is.

 

I've mentioned this plenty of times on here, but I think that Bosh has become one of the more underrated players in the league since he joined up with Wade and James in Miami. He was a top 10 player in the league his final season with Toronto and was routinely a top 15 player every other year of his Toronto prime and it seems like people forget how good he actually is.

 

As number one options on their respective teams, Bosh was more productive than Aldridge:

 

Aldridge - 21.8 ppg, 8.5 rpg, 2.2 apg, 1 bpg with a 21.9 PER and 55 TS%

Bosh - 22.8 ppg, 9.9 rpg, 2.5 apg, 1.1 bpg with a 23.2 PER and 58 TS%

 

I'm actually pleasently surprised that Bosh was included in the top 20 due to his relatively small role on the Heat, at least in regards to all the other players on the list.

 

Thats true. I was also pretty surprised to see him in the top 20.

[Cleveland's Finest]

Kevin Love does not deserve to be in the top 10 yet. Dirk, Rondo, and even Melo deserve to be ahead of him.

 

Dwight being third is a joke. He had probably the most disappointing season of his career when you look at the expectations....and he's top 3?

[Check my Stats]

Kevin Love does not deserve to be in the top 10 yet. Dirk, Rondo, and even Melo deserve to be ahead of him.

 

Dwight being third is a joke. He had probably the most disappointing season of his career when you look at the expectations....and he's top 3?

 

I don't even know where to start.....

[NomarFachix]

I don't even know where to start.....

lol

[Flash]

I get the Dwight love, but I'm not putting him over KD or CP3.