Preseason Basketball Discussion

[Real Deal]

Everyone looked lost out there, once they started running those deep sets into the Princeton playbook, LOL. Turnover city.

 

Our bench didn't even run the offense...not sure what they did, honestly. Brown stuck Sacre, Jamison, Ebanks, Meeks and Duhon out there all by themselves, and I was feeling bad for Jamison, haha.

 

Wish I saw more from Thomas Robinson...and DeMarcus Cousins is a cancer.

[Real Deal]

Lakers' bench outscored by Sacramento's bench, 57-18.

 

Can't wait to trim this roster, and have our bigs rotating to where they can be out there the entire time.

[Lemon]

I liked what was going on with duhon with the exception of him shooting in transition. The rest of the second unit just look lost though. You know something is wrong when sacre is having to shoot the ball.

 

Otherwise, the starters looked fun. Great defensive energy, but offensively you can tell they lacked chemistry. there was some rust, but I was just too excited to see dh with a laker uni

[Built Ford Tough]

Did Cousins have 4 or 5 fouls in the first half? I lost track after he sat with his 3rd and can't remember if he got just one more or two after coming back in.

 

Either way, that dude is so much fun to watch. You just never know what the hell he is going to do out there.

[Make It Naaaashty]

Dwight looked really good for his first preseason game and so did the rest of the starters. As long as the starting 5 are healthy, this squad is going to be very exciting to watch.

[Real Deal]

Did Cousins have 4 or 5 fouls in the first half? I lost track after he sat with his 3rd and can't remember if he got just one more or two after coming back in.

 

Either way, that dude is so much fun to watch. You just never know what the hell he is going to do out there.

I thought he only had three, but that was early in the second quarter, and the entire team had like 14-15 fouls with nine minutes to go in that second, lol. I think the Kings grabbed Howard maybe three times in that half, one to prevent a lob from connecting and two in order to prevent two wide-open dunks.

[Built Ford Tough]

I thought he only had three, but that was early in the second quarter, and the entire team had like 14-15 fouls with nine minutes to go in that second, lol. I think the Kings grabbed Howard maybe three times in that half, one to prevent a lob from connecting and two in order to prevent two wide-open dunks.

 

I only watched the first half so maybe they changed it at half time or something, but I know he had 3 in the first quarter and then he came back into the game and immediately got an offensive foul for a push off on Gasol when trying to establish position. That would make it 4 and I could've swore I heard the Laker announcers mention him getting another foul later.

 

Not really a big deal or anything, I just found it hilarious how, like you mentioned, Cousins and the other King players were fouling so frequently.

 

 

 

On another note, Tyreke Evans continues to look like crap. The Kings really need to just cut their losses with him and move on. It is pretty damn obvious that Evans and the Kings just aren't meshing and that it is time for both parties to go their seperate ways. He is a horrible fit on the roster and doesn't look to give a shit at all.

[Real Deal]

Ah, yeah...him and Gasol were battling for position, and Gasol gave him that PauFlop. I remember it now, lol.

 

Cousins was just frustrated the entire game. He set a screen on Kobe in the first quarter, and Kobe ran him over...but even worse, Cousins fell as if he was 150 pounds. Then, later in the game, he set another screen, raised his elbow, and got Kobe in the upper chest region (almost in the throat), and they had words for each other after that.

 

DeMarcus just lets his attitude get the best of him, and when he's frustrated, he sees no reason to ever pass the ball, and he starts missing easy shots from close range.

 

As far as Tyreke goes...yeah, he's done with Sactown, and I'm sure they are going to be done with him. Again, I blame both parties...Evans for not being a man and just doing what he's paid to do, and the Kings for playing him three positions and not understanding how to utilize his skillset.

[Built Ford Tough]

In Cousins' defense, Kobe did just absolutely barrel into him on that screen he set. I don't really blame him for being upset with that play since Kobe made absolutely no effort to do anything other than run right into him. I really don't think there was any flopping involved on that play (if that is what you are insinuating) since you don't really expect to be run into like that when setting a screen.

 

Like I said earlier, I didn't watch the 2nd half and I didn't see the second screen you are talking about, so I can't comment on it. As long as it wasn't malicious, I can't really blame Cousins for getting more physical with that one based on what Kobe did (not that I find anything wrong with that, either) in the first half.

[Real Deal]

In Cousins' defense, Kobe did just absolutely barrel into him on that screen he set. I don't really blame him for being upset with that play since Kobe made absolutely no effort to do anything other than run right into him. I really don't think there was any flopping involved on that play (if that is what you are insinuating) since you don't really expect to be run into like that when setting a screen.

 

Like I said earlier, I didn't watch the 2nd half and I didn't see the second screen you are talking about, so I can't comment on it. As long as it wasn't malicious, I can't really blame Cousins for getting more physical with that one based on what Kobe did (not that I find anything wrong with that, either) in the first half.

I don't know. It didn't seem like Kobe ran through him hard enough to knock him down and send him sliding. Maybe if it was Shane Battier, but Cousins is a big, big man.

 

KB is probably the strongest player in all of NBA history, though, and Cousins is lucky Bryant didn't do to him what he did to Chris Childs, and attempt to break Cousins' hand with his neck.

[Built Ford Tough]

I'm not saying Kobe is LeBron or anything, but when you are hit much harder than you anticpiated and didn't brace yourself for impact, there is a damn good chance you will be knocked on your ass.

 

If Cousins properly braced himself and prepared for Kobe ramming into him then I would completely agree that he flopped, but that wasn't the case. I think more than anything it was just a shock factor that resulted in Cousins going down and nothing he did on purpose.

[NomarFachix]

DeMarcus Cousins drove from 20' and finished off the glass, all with his off hand. Name another NBA C who could. #youcant

[Built Ford Tough]

DeMarcus Cousins drove from 20' and finished off the glass, all with his off hand. Name another NBA C who could. #youcant

 

I haven't actually seen him do it personally, but it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Greg Monroe has done it before. I saw him do stuff like that at Georgetown fairly often since he was always operating in the high post and from around 18 feet.

 

If Bargnani is classified as a C (since up until this year he has played C) he has done it multiple times, although I'm fine with anybody who considers him, and has always considered him, a PF.

 

But yeah, I completely understand the point you are making. It really is a shame that Cousins is such a head case because talent wise, he stacks up against any big in the league. I really do wonder what his development would be like if he didn't get drafted into such a shitty situation. If he had a coach who didn't put up with his bullshit and let him get away with the crazy shit he does (both on and off the court) how different of a player would he be today? Or is he just one of those guys who will never get it regardless of the situation he is in?

[The Regime]

Laker starting five looked good last night for the most part (only watched the second and third quarter). Ball was moving well, and everyone except maybe Pau was involved. It doesn't look like Dwight has missed a beat. It's still really weird to see Nash in a Laker uni, and is it me or does he look sickly skinny? Conditioning wont be and has never been an issue for him, but I just hope he doesn't get abused by bigger pg's.

 

One thing that looked a little concerning was lazy defensive play from our perimeter players. I thought the Kings were getting to the hole a little too easily. I'm not sure if that's because we didn't care because it's a preseason game or because we have the luxury of Dwight controlling the paint but that needs to be sured up in weeks time.

 

All in all I cant wait for the season to tip off, this team is going to be nasty.

[JYD]

Melo is a joke lol. I hate Fields' contract but I don't think Melo realizes players like (important word here, like) Fields are players that help win championships. This kid just really doesn't see the big picture, and its going to drive you Knicks fans crazy for the next half a decade until he fizzles into obscurity.

You're on one man. I was just reading through this thread. if 59% from the FT line and 25% from 3 pt line from your 2-guard is a player that helps win championships then you know nothing about basketball

[DunkinDerozan]

Raptors looked solid again tonight. Still some problems to work out, mainly the amount of unforced turnovers we've been giving up. Still, I'm very happy with our team and our preseason record. Beating teams like Detroit, Washington and Milwaukee is going to be crucial if we want to make a playoff push this year. Oh, and Derozan looks amazing. Can't [expletive]ing wait for the season to start. AND I'm going to the season opener

[Built Ford Tough]

You're on one man. I was just reading through this thread. if 59% from the FT line and 25% from 3 pt line from your 2-guard is a player that helps win championships then you know nothing about basketball

 

As opposed to JR Smith, right?

 

Seriously though, he said players like Fields, players who don't need the ball to contribute, guys who help contribute on the glass, play defense and don't force their games. Obviously Fields isn't a starting player on a championship team, nobody is saying otherwise, but you need guys like him (again, like him) who are happy doing the dirty work and contribute in ways other than scoring.

 

 

As for the Raptors game tonight:

 

- I thought Lowry was bad the first 3 quarters. Aside from his defense on Jennings, I didn't like what I saw from him through the first 3 quarters. A lot of his passes were way off target and he looked sloppy. However, once he came back in the game during the 4th it was a complete 180. He was huge and made key play after key play down the stretch. He is the first real "closer" that the Raptors have had since pre-Horford TJ Ford.

 

- DeRozan really took advantage of his size against the smaller Milwaukee backcourt. Whenever he had Ellis, Jennings or Udrih guarding him, he immediately established post position and went to work. He really needs to learn to pick his spots better, though. He has too many of those 1 on 3 attacks that result in either a wild shot or forced turnover. If he continues to operate in the post, I really hope he develops his passing game, especially since his height will allow him to see over the top of most 2 guards. I don't ever expect 5 assists a game from him, I just want him to be less of a blackhole.

 

- Bargnani's offense looks to be starting to come around. I've liked what I've seen from him defensively for most of the preseason and that continued tonight. On offense, his jumper doesn't look nearly as flat as it was in the earlier games and he is moving better as well. What I liked the most from him tonight was his rebounding. I realize he only got 4 boards, but I think 3 of those were late in the 4th and they weren't his usual gimmie boards. He really fought for them and came away with tough boards in traffic. As long as he comes up with the big boards late, I'm fine with him being a sieve on the glass for first 40. Ok, maybe I'm not fine with it, but I can put up with it, haha.

 

- Valanciunas was his usual active self. I think he finished with 10/8/4 and I love the fact that he went 8-10 from the line. It may not be as much of a factor this season, but in future years when he adds strength and gets more comfortable, his free throw shooting is going to get him a lot of points given how often I expect him to be at the stripe. I think it is safe to say that Valanciunas has earned the starting spot and the only time Gray should see the floor is when they are playing Howard or Bynum.

 

- Amir and Ed make up one of the best bench big duos in the league, especially if Amir's new found shooting prowess continues into the regular season. His jumper has looked fantastic so far in the preseason. Davis is just a beast on the glass (5 boards in 12 minutes tonight). I really like having these two off the bench.

 

 

Now for the negatives:

 

- Fields was brutal tonight. His rebounding was solid, but other than that he was just bad. He has absolutely no confidence in his shot at all and needs to totally re-work it. It is just completely broken and it is at the point where it looks like Casey can't afford to have him on the floor late in the game because his shooting is such a liability.

 

- Way too many turnovers. I think they finished with around 20 and a lot of them were unforced. This has been a problem all preseason and is something that they really need to work out because they don't have enough talent to overcome this many turnovers on a nightly basis.

 

- The Calderon/Lucas backcourt is giving me nightmares from the Forderon or Cack lineups that we used to see. Play them for a full 48 minutes together during the last preseason game for all I care. I just pray that I see very, very little of it during the regular season.

 

 

I'll end the post here to avoid making it an unreadable wall of text.

[AboveLegit]

The Lowry/JV pnr has so much potential. Really excited to see those two this year.

[Check my Stats]

You're on one man. I was just reading through this thread. if 59% from the FT line and 25% from 3 pt line from your 2-guard is a player that helps win championships then you know nothing about basketball

 

If you think you can win without quality role players, not Landry Fields specifically, (my clear point, at least I thought), then there's nothing really here to discuss. Shut up and move along please, you're just being annoying.

 

EDIT: BFT already covered it.

Edited October 23, 2012 by Check my Stats

[NomarFachix]

If you think you can win without quality role players, not Landry Fields specifically, (my clear point, at least I thought), then there's nothing really here to discuss.

We have those though, and they're all better than Landry Fields lol.. so I'm not sure what the point is

[JYD]

If you think you can win without quality role players, not Landry Fields specifically, (my clear point, at least I thought), then there's nothing really here to discuss. Shut up and move along please, you're just being annoying.

 

EDIT: BFT already covered it.

Ok, so you specifically pointed to Fields originally, now you're saying players 'like' Fields.

 

Landry Fields is a mediocre (at best) defensive player. He's slow. He is a good player in transition, and he is a good passer for a 2-guard and has decent size.

 

He's a mediocre rebounder for his position, he's a mediocre defensive player, and can not hit FT's or 3 point shots. He has one of the worst looking shots I've ever seen (way too flat).

 

And JR Smith is WAY better than Landry Fields. And I'll take Ronnie Brewer over him too.

[AboveLegit]

Landry Fields is a mediocre (at best) defensive player. He's slow. He is a good player in transition, and he is a good passer for a 2-guard and has decent size.

I agree that he's a pretty average defender, but he has quick hands, plays the lanes well, and doesn't foul much. So at least when he's on the floor, he's not hurting your team.

 

He's a mediocre rebounder for his position, he's a mediocre defensive player, and can not hit FT's or 3 point shots. He has one of the worst looking shots I've ever seen (way too flat).

He was top 10 in rebounding for all guards last year.

Edited October 23, 2012 by AboveLegit

[JYD]

I agree that he's a pretty average defender, but he has quick hands, plays the lanes well, and doesn't foul much. So at least when he's on the floor, he's not hurting your team.

 

 

He was top 10 last year in rebounding last year for all guards.

The problem with Fields is he can sometimes give other 2-guards problem with his size at 6'7, but he is generally pretty slow...especially his first step. He's gotten torched over the past two seasons by Ray Allen running off screen's. It was brutal to watch. He just couldn't get there to make any type of difference. When Shumpert was out there, what a difference.

 

Landry Fields has no business being a starting 2-guard in the NBA. Not even on a struggling franchise like Toronto. It's a [expletive]ing sham how overrated he has gotten.

 

He's a nice 7-9th player in the NBA. He can give you some decent minutes in a confined role. But, I'm telling you, because of his surprising showing in the first half of his rookie year, he has been way overrated. People act like he's a quality starter. He's not.

[AboveLegit]

I definitely agree that he's lived off the reputation he built in the first half of his rookie year. He needs to make the transition to SF, because as you said, he's pretty slow.

 

But I also think it's unfair to bring up his failure in guarding Ray Allen, and the difference between him and Shumpert (who's a world class defender IMO).

 

Knicks were smart in letting him go, I think it was brilliant to bring in Ronnie Brewer who's a much better defender, and an equally impressive off ball player.

[JYD]

I definitely agree that he's lived off the reputation he built in the first half of his rookie year. He needs to make the transition to SF, because as you said, he's pretty slow.

 

But I also think it's unfair to bring up his failure in guarding Ray Allen, and the difference between him and Shumpert (who's a world class defender IMO).

 

Knicks were smart in letting him go, I think it was brilliant to bring in Ronnie Brewer who's a much better defender, and an equally impressive off ball player.

Exactly. Sure it's unfair comparing him to Shumpert... but I hear a lot of people saying (not a shot at anyone on this site - just announcers or fans in general) that Fields is a good defensive player. I just don't see where they get that from. Sure, he's not the worst defensive player I've ever seen, but he is not a 'good' defensive 2-guard. He just has some size, that's about it.

Edited October 23, 2012 by JYD