Erick Blasco's Top 30 NBA Centers

[Diesel]

You can't make exceptions to top 10 lists "at full health" or whatnot. Durability is an aspect of the game. When you ignore one of Howard's biggest strengths and Yao's biggest weaknesses it isn't a valid comparison. And we're not talking about freak injuries or something out of the blue. Yao hasn't been able to evade an injury plagued season or a year where he was unable to play at the end of the year since his third year in the league in 2004-2005. 7'6 guys are unnatural and are going to get hurt. The body isn't meant to maintain that kind of height. His left foot has had multiple major injuries to it in recent years and it is not something that can be ignored.

 

And Shaq owns every Center not named Yao, Dwight, Duncan(if you consider him one)

 

Amare Stoudemire has a nice offensive game, but not only is his help defense bad but his one on one defense is even worse. I think Blasco exagerrated about how bad his defense is, but it is pretty bad lol. Without Amare the Suns haven't missed a beat(both in 2006 and in this past year). And if you want to say they missed the playoffs without him they weren't making it with him either.

 

Al Jefferson gets owned if he's doubled and makes a terrible decision, and is just a terrible defensive player overall. Shaq is one of the best bigmen in league history at finding guys out of double teams and it's one of his asset's that's made him so dominant. Shaq is superior defensively to Jefferson and a much smarter offensive player too. Al Jefferson is not a true dominant bigman.

 

And Bynum? Seriously? Only a laker fan would argue that Bynum > Shaq. The same guy that averaged 6.3 PPG and 3 RPG in the playoffs and has never played good basketball for a period longer than two weeks. Bynum hasn't proven [expletive] to say he's better than Shaq who was a legit all-star last year.

[Lone Wolf]

 

 

Al Jefferson gets owned if he's doubled and makes a terrible decision, and is just a terrible defensive player overall. Shaq is one of the best bigmen in league history at finding guys out of double teams and it's one of his asset's that's made him so dominant. Shaq is superior defensively to Jefferson and a much smarter offensive player too. Al Jefferson is not a true dominant bigman.

 

 

 

 

What? Are you serious? I've seen Jefferson get double or even triple teamed and still makes those hook shots, dunks, finger rolls, etc. Could you really blame him for not passing because he could make those shots and his teammates couldn't? Have you even seen how he plays?

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcT7JTmPPrk

Edited August 25, 2009 by Lone Wolf

[Erick Blasco]

Well the first thing I saw on this list was Tim Duncan being listed as a center. He was listed as a Power Foward all last year whiles Bonner player center.

 

And at this point Al Jefferson is the 3rd best center in the game in front of Shaq, Al has some of the best post moves in the leauge and is underrated on the defensive end. I mean really what's the difference between Al Jefferson post moves compared to Dwight's post moves and Dwight's post defense compared to Al Jefferson's post defense. There's a large gap between the 2. Al Jefferson was 14th in shot blocking whiles last year Shaq was 21'st if I'm correct. Al Jefferson was a better rebounder last year a much better scorer if you compare their stats per 48 minutes.

 

Bonner is as much of a center as me and you. He's a forward. The Spurs list Duncan at forward because they've always listed him at power forward, and always will, but he's a center, at least at this point in time.

 

Howard was a much more athletic shot blocker, and a better player without the ball.Jefferson is literally useless when the ball isn't in his hands while Howard is a fantastic dive cutter. Scoring, AJ is better, but rebounding, Howard is world's better.

 

AJ can score in the post, but so can Shaq. The difference is to look at each player when they're doubled. Shaq can still score, and is a very good passer, while AJ is a turnover waiting to happen. And Jefferson is worse at guarding his man than even Shaq.

 

Nice write up like always, but most of the centers you listed are more talented than Shaq.

 

There are how many centers that consistently command double teams in the league? And how man yof those have the footwork of Shaq, can pass as well as Shaq, and score as potently as Shaq? Please, don't say Emeka Okafor.

 

You're really going to say that when the Wolves shooting was terrible? Hell, I wouldn't want to pass to my team mates if they couldn't make a shot and I could score with 2 to 3 players on me.

 

Besides that, great job on the article.

 

I'm going to say it when he puts the ball on the floor, a second defender slides over, and Jefferson makes some horrendous pass leading to a fast break the other way.

 

Brad Miller is better than Joakim Noah lol.

 

Miller is not only one of the softest players in the league, but he's also one of the least athletic. He's a defensive liability, and doesn't bring too much offensively besides his high post passing. That's why opponents he faces in the playoffs always do well against him, and he underwhelms in the playoffs. He shot 40% on two pointers against the Celtics and committed more than two turnovers for every assist. This from a passing specialist?

 

I have a question, Erick. Did you take away the concerns of Yao and Duncan's health? Or Are you factoring them?

 

That's a good question. It was very hard for me to determine exactly where to rank Yao because of the injury, so I judged the players on what they would normally contribute to a team. Yao is normally injury prone so I factored that into account, but he usually isn't injured for entire seasons. So his injury-prone status played a factor, but not the fact that he's probably out for the year.

 

Because it pisses me off that all of the sudden he becomes a top 5 center now that he plays for LeBron's team.

 

He was a Top 5 center over the regular season too. Unless you think Andrew Bynum, for this season only, is ready to take the maturity leap needed to be a truly great center.

 

Duncan plays the four constantly...but if you're listing him at the five, he's better than Howard, by miles. He's the far better developed offensive player, second or third most skilled player in the NBA, and his defensive awareness and his man-to-man defense is better than Dwight's.

 

If Yao was healthy, it would be a coin toss between him and Dwight, with Duncan coming out on top, regardless.

 

But I'll say Duncan is a true forward, and I'll make a mini-list of my top ten.

 

All players at full health...

 

1) Yao Ming

2) Dwight Howard

3) Amar'e Stoudemire

4) Al Jefferson

5) Shaquille O'Neal

6) Andrew Bynum

7) Kendrick Perkins

8) Nene

9) Emeka Okafor

10) Brook Lopez

 

I know Bargnani and Okur did alright last season, scored buckets and all, but they play zero defense AND play like they are small forwards or two-guards.

 

And I'm going to value defense, Erick, but I can't say that Dwight is the best center in the league. I think that has a lot to do with Orlando's success which, to be honest, has a lot to do with Howard's teammates.

 

82 games did a nice job listing exactly how many minutes at each position each player played last season, and Duncan spent his majority of his minutes at the 5, a trend I don't see changing.

 

I love Duncan, but you can see his armor starting to chink away. I hate making individual one-on-one comparisons as overall comparisons, but you can see the way Duncan gets overwhelmed when the Spurs play the Magic. Plus, Duncan is injury prone now, while Howard has shown that he can make adjustments to his game each offseason.

 

I think the head, will, and mind is there for Duncan, but I don't think the body is holding up.

 

I think Yao is a clear step down from Duncan.

 

What exactly do you see in Bynum that you don't see in Perkins. And not potential, I mean, clear on court production. Bynum gets eaten up by Perkins and he has a lot of defensive problems that his offense can't compensate for. Perkins isn't an offensive monster, but he has some post skills and is a great post defender who is only improving.

 

And I think Okafor is one of the most overrated players in the game. He's a nice, solid player who gets treated like a star.

[Erick Blasco]

Here would be my Top 10 though, Erick..... Duncan is a forward but if you want to count him as a center I will.....and I am not factoring health into this.

 

1. Tim Duncan

2. Yao Ming

3. Dwight Howard

4. Al Jefferson

5. Shaquille O'Neal

6. Nene

7. Kendrick Perkins

8. Brook Lopez

9. Andrew Bynum

10. Emeka Okafor

 

Nene isn't consistent enough to be sixth. He'd do nothing against Perkins and Bynum does more than Nene when he's healthy. Plus health is still a concern for Nene.

 

Brook Lopez is good, but do you want a second year player on your team who isn't an athletic monster if you're gunning for a title?

 

Marcus Camby > Al Horford?

 

Gortat > Biedrins?

 

You're a smart guy, but come on.

 

Horford's decent, but he's a power forward playing center who has too many games where he doesn't show up. At least Camby's rebounding will show up.

 

I like Biedrins, I really do. I think he'd be a great backup on a good team. But what does he realisticaly provide besides energy and shot blocking? He can't score. He can't defend a lamp post. He can't defend screens. He can't shoot. He can't handle. He can't post. He's a good enough rebounder, but he stands out for being a player who plays hard on a team tha tdoesn't play hard. That's nice, but it doesn't make Biedrins special.

 

It's like David Lee. He's the best player on a bad team and he does everything that's asked of him without any complaints. That doesn't mean he's a special talent.

 

Erick loves defense.

 

B) B) B)

 

 

There's no rock on emoticon anymore!?!?!?!

 

I'd take Nene over Bynum no offense to Laker fans. I know you up on Bynum's grill but I just don't see how he's 'that' good when he hasn't shown he's been able to play when it matters.

 

The same person loafing back in transition alongside Bynum during the Lakers-Nuggets WCF was Nene. Nene's had one productive season in about five years and still takes too many plays off. Let's see if Nene can build upon his success, and if a healthy Bynum can rebound after a disappointing postseason.

 

You can't make exceptions to top 10 lists "at full health" or whatnot. Durability is an aspect of the game. When you ignore one of Howard's biggest strengths and Yao's biggest weaknesses it isn't a valid comparison. And we're not talking about freak injuries or something out of the blue. Yao hasn't been able to evade an injury plagued season or a year where he was unable to play at the end of the year since his third year in the league in 2004-2005. 7'6 guys are unnatural and are going to get hurt. The body isn't meant to maintain that kind of height. His left foot has had multiple major injuries to it in recent years and it is not something that can be ignored.

 

And Shaq owns every Center not named Yao, Dwight, Duncan(if you consider him one)

 

Amare Stoudemire has a nice offensive game, but not only is his help defense bad but his one on one defense is even worse. I think Blasco exagerrated about how bad his defense is, but it is pretty bad lol. Without Amare the Suns haven't missed a beat(both in 2006 and in this past year). And if you want to say they missed the playoffs without him they weren't making it with him either.

 

Al Jefferson gets owned if he's doubled and makes a terrible decision, and is just a terrible defensive player overall. Shaq is one of the best bigmen in league history at finding guys out of double teams and it's one of his asset's that's made him so dominant. Shaq is superior defensively to Jefferson and a much smarter offensive player too. Al Jefferson is not a true dominant bigman.

 

And Bynum? Seriously? Only a laker fan would argue that Bynum > Shaq. The same guy that averaged 6.3 PPG and 3 RPG in the playoffs and has never played good basketball for a period longer than two weeks. Bynum hasn't proven [expletive] to say he's better than Shaq who was a legit all-star last year.

 

I think the argument against Yao was that you have to assume he'd play this year or else why include him in the list? ClutchCity asked a good question regarding my methodology. Basically, I'll assume Yao will play this year, but his major injury problems will still be a problem. Assuming he didn't have a broken foot, he'd still be a player prone to getting broken bones and bad legs, which is a serious drawback. He'd still be better than 98% of the centers in the league, but not good enough to overtake Howard.

 

And I agree with everything you said. You took the words out of my mouth. Except, Amare really is that bad

 

What? Are you serious? I've seen Jefferson get double or even triple teamed and still makes those hook shots, dunks, finger rolls, etc. Could you really blame him for not passing because he could make those shots and his teammates couldn't? Have you even seen how he plays?

 

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=FcT7JTmPPrk

 

Jefferson's talented enough where he's going to make some nice plays against doubles, but how consistently does he do that? He has more turnovers than assists, and against the number of doubles he faces, how he can have less that 2 assists a game is awful.

 

His defense is awful, and he's a black hole on offense. He plays exactly like a young Zach Randolph.

Edited August 26, 2009 by Real Deal

[Lone Wolf]

I'm going to say it when he puts the ball on the floor, a second defender slides over, and Jefferson makes some horrendous pass leading to a fast break the other way.

 

 

Jefferson's talented enough where he's going to make some nice plays against doubles, but how consistently does he do that? He has more turnovers than assists, and against the number of doubles he faces, how he can have less that 2 assists a game is awful.

 

His defense is awful, and he's a black hole on offense. He plays exactly like a young Zach Randolph.

I rarely see that.

 

 

He does it consistently enough. His movement is so quick, that he can go around the double teams and make a nice hook shot, finger roll, etc. Well yeah, what do expect from a player who cannot trust his teammates due to their lack of shooting? When I saw him kick it out to whomever, they'd miss the shot which would make me throw up. Jefferson found out that they couldn't shoot at all, so he decided to become more selfish with the ball.

 

His defense has been improving, slowly.

 

I heard the Wolves want to become a faster paced offense, so we'll see how Jefferson fits into this change.

 

 

 

We'll have to see how this upcoming season will be like. I just hope Jefferson decides to change your mind.

Edited August 25, 2009 by Lone Wolf

[His Greatness]

Perkins is too much of a nonfactor everywhere else for me to rank him that high, but I can see the argument. Above Bynum and Stoudemire, though? His defense is not that dominant yet. And Stoudemire has to be ranked in the top 5 at the very least if he qualifies as a center.

 

Chandler will be moved down a few spots when you get a whiff of his production without Chris Paul.

 

A healthy Kaman dominates the glass, erases every shot in his vicinity, and is deceptively talented on offense. If you can give Yao a pass, I think Kaman deserves one too. Ditto for Bogut, who I think is unbelievably underrated in general, and is actually a pretty good defender.

 

And is Big Z really better than Lee, Horford, Gortat, Biedrins, and Bargnani? What does he do now besides shoot jumpers and get punished defensively?

 

As always, quality article and top-notch analysis. I expected the wild selections and snubbings, but it's good for discussion.

[s.t.a.t.]

IMO Jefferson is playing out of place...IMO he should be more of a PF but we have no legit C. And how many of you even really know anything about Jefferson? since no on hardly watches the wolves unless you are a fan and they are never on TV unless you live in the area haha, so it kinda amazes me how ppl talk like they have watched him over and over again.

[Lone Wolf]

IMO Jefferson is playing out of place...IMO he should be more of a PF but we have no legit C. And how many of you even really know anything about Jefferson? since no on hardly watches the wolves unless you are a fan and they are never on TV unless you live in the area haha, so it kinda amazes me how ppl talk like they have watched him over and over again.

They're a yawn fest. No one watches them!

[Real Deal]

I watch him.

[Erick Blasco]

Perkins is too much of a nonfactor everywhere else for me to rank him that high, but I can see the argument. Above Bynum and Stoudemire, though? His defense is not that dominant yet. And Stoudemire has to be ranked in the top 5 at the very least if he qualifies as a center.

 

Chandler will be moved down a few spots when you get a whiff of his production without Chris Paul.

 

A healthy Kaman dominates the glass, erases every shot in his vicinity, and is deceptively talented on offense. If you can give Yao a pass, I think Kaman deserves one too. Ditto for Bogut, who I think is unbelievably underrated in general, and is actually a pretty good defender.

 

And is Big Z really better than Lee, Horford, Gortat, Biedrins, and Bargnani? What does he do now besides shoot jumpers and get punished defensively?

 

As always, quality article and top-notch analysis. I expected the wild selections and snubbings, but it's good for discussion.

 

He's better than Bynum right now, for sure. Perkins' defense is top notch good, plus he can score in the post. Has Bynum shown that he can be a factor against good teams? He was a dud in the playoffs and good offenses confuse the heck out of him. And he's not a consistent scorer yet, plus he loses focus too easily because all he wants to do is score.

 

Stoudemire is one of those players who inspires absolutely no confidence in producing with anything on the line. His talent is off the charts, but he's a losing player. As long as someone isn't a scrub, I'll give the other player the benefit of the doubt. You can even make the case of dropping him a spot. Bynum's coming out party came two Christmas' ago when he destroyed Amar'e straight up.

 

If Chandler plays the same defense he played two years ago, I can take him scoring less than double-figures.

 

I think Kaman is deceptively untalented. I see him play against any center who can move and he gets his shots blocked left and right. But he's pretty good. Besides Chandler though, who do you see below him? Same with Bogut? He doesn't command doubles and he's not a great defender. Would you rather have him than the best post defender in the game, and two of the best help defenders in the game?

 

I don't think Ilgauskas is as bad defensively as people think. He got decimated by Howard, but against the rest of the centers, he's not too shabby. He eats space, can hit jumpers, can score against midget-sized centers. Lee and Biedrins are really just running rebounders, Horford did nothing against Ilgauskas in the playoffs (though injuries played a part) and has games where he doesn't show up at all, and I don't beleive that Gortat is a star.

Edited August 26, 2009 by Erick Blasco

[Erick Blasco]

IMO Jefferson is playing out of place...IMO he should be more of a PF but we have no legit C. And how many of you even really know anything about Jefferson? since no on hardly watches the wolves unless you are a fan and they are never on TV unless you live in the area haha, so it kinda amazes me how ppl talk like they have watched him over and over again.

 

You can get a feel for a player if he's prominent enough and you watch him play 10 games over a couple of years, especially if you look for specific things each subsequent time you watch him. There are also so many good blogs, writers, and places like Draftexpress.com that can give people decent overviews of what a player is all about.

[Big Penny]

And Bynum? Seriously? Only a laker fan would argue that Bynum > Shaq. The same guy that averaged 6.3 PPG and 3 RPG in the playoffs and has never played good basketball for a period longer than two weeks. Bynum hasn't proven [expletive] to say he's better than Shaq who was a legit all-star last year.

shaq is better than drew, but come on. only played good basketball for two weeks? have u ever seen him play?

 

what id like to know, is how come jameer nelson played bad in the playoffs becuase he was coming back from an injury, and noone cared, but drew gets injured and plays bad in the playoffs and all of a sudden hes a bad player? double standards...

[AtTheDriveIn]

shaq is better than drew, but come on. only played good basketball for two weeks? have u ever seen him play?

 

You took that out of context. He said that Bynum hasn't played good basketball for longer than a period of two weeks, not that he's only played two weeks of good basketball.

[Lone Wolf]

I watch him.

 

 

You can get a feel for a player if he's prominent enough and you watch him play 10 games over a couple of years, especially if you look for specific things each subsequent time you watch him. There are also so many good blogs, writers, and places like Draftexpress.com that can give people decent overviews of what a player is all about.

Liar!

 

 

10 games?.. I disagree big time. I'd rather watch the player myself than depend on other people's opinions about the player (which can be wrong at points).

[His Greatness]

He's better than Bynum right now, for sure. Perkins' defense is top notch good, plus he can score in the post. Has Bynum shown that he can be a factor against good teams? He was a dud in the playoffs and good offenses confuse the heck out of him. And he's not a consistent scorer yet, plus he loses focus too easily because all he wants to do is score.

Perkins is sloppy on offense and is a robot in the pivot. Sure he can score in the post, but that's like saying Steve Nash can play defense — they'll do it sometimes, but don't hold your breath. And according to Draft Express, he turns the ball over on 1/3 of his offensive possessions. Offensively, it's not even worth comparing the two, whereas I feel their defenses are more comparable because Bynum is more versatile there and is a better rebounder (on offense too).

 

He was a dud in the playoffs because he had no knees.

 

22 points, 4 boards, 3 blocks against Utah

16 points, 7 boards against Denver

15 points, 11 boards, 4 blocks against San Antonio

42 points against the Clippers. They're a bad team, but Perkins will never sniff 42 points in his life.

18 points, 10 boards against Dallas

13 points, 13 boards against Denver

 

And he was averaging 19.1 PPG on a 17-game stretch before his season ended.

 

There's no scrutiny placed on Perkins' inability to do these things because he's a limited player that's only good in a limited role. To me, Bynum's impact is easily more irreplaceable.

 

Stoudemire is one of those players who inspires absolutely no confidence in producing with anything on the line. His talent is off the charts, but he's a losing player. As long as someone isn't a scrub, I'll give the other player the benefit of the doubt. You can even make the case of dropping him a spot. Bynum's coming out party came two Christmas' ago when he destroyed Amar'e straight up.

How is he a losing player? Is it his dominant scoring ability? You can knock him all day for his defense, but he excels so much at scoring that it transcends his vices, and that aspect alone should elevate him into the top five.

 

Why does Jefferson belong up there but Stoudemire doesn't? And are Jefferson, Shaq, Perkins and Bynum really more equipped to carry their teams to victory than Amar'e?

 

I think Kaman is deceptively untalented. I see him play against any center who can move and he gets his shots blocked left and right. But he's pretty good. Besides Chandler though, who do you see below him? Same with Bogut? He doesn't command doubles and he's not a great defender. Would you rather have him than the best post defender in the game, and two of the best help defenders in the game?

Okafor, Lopez, and Nene. Did you see Kaman play two years ago when he was healthy? If you can do that with Chandler, why not with him?

 

I'll take Bogut over Przybilla and Wallace. Przybilla doesn't do enough for me defensively, and Wallace is an up-and-down player who I'm convinced is more concerned with launching treys than doing other things more conducive to winning. At least Bogut will always give me a 100%, ten boards, and solid defense and offense.

 

I don't think Ilgauskas is as bad defensively as people think. He got decimated by Howard, but against the rest of the centers, he's not too shabby. He eats space, can hit jumpers, can score against midget-sized centers. Lee and Biedrins are really just running rebounders, Horford did nothing against Ilgauskas in the playoffs (though injuries played a part) and has games where he doesn't show up at all, and I don't beleive that Gortat is a star.

Lee will control the glass, play without the ball, and always hustle. Likewise with Biedrins, who will also impact the game defensively. They're both a 1000x more athletic and mobile than Z. If Ilgauskas wasn't playing with such great defensive support, the sieve we saw against Orlando would become commonplace.

[Diesel]

shaq is better than drew, but come on. only played good basketball for two weeks? have u ever seen him play?

 

what id like to know, is how come jameer nelson played bad in the playoffs becuase he was coming back from an injury, and noone cared, but drew gets injured and plays bad in the playoffs and all of a sudden hes a bad player? double standards...

 

Because Jameer Nelson was playing all-star basketball for the entire season up until it ended. Bynum was only playing all-star basketball for a period of 2 weeks or so and that's the only time in his career he's shown that flash. I'd like to see him do it for a longer period of time.

 

Plus Bynum was available for the entire playoffs and was starting while Nelson obviously rushed back too soon to play a back-up role for the NBA Finals.

 

I could tell your team rep without even looking at it.

 

Perkins is sloppy on offense and is a robot in the pivot. Sure he can score in the post, but that's like saying Steve Nash can play defense — they'll do it sometimes, but don't hold your breath. And according to Draft Express, he turns the ball over on 1/3 of his offensive possessions. Offensively, it's not even worth comparing the two, whereas I feel their defenses are more comparable because Bynum is more versatile there and is a better rebounder (on offense too).

 

He was a dud in the playoffs because he had no knees.

 

22 points, 4 boards, 3 blocks against Utah

16 points, 7 boards against Denver

15 points, 11 boards, 4 blocks against San Antonio

42 points against the Clippers. They're a bad team, but Perkins will never sniff 42 points in his life.

18 points, 10 boards against Dallas

13 points, 13 boards against Denver

 

And he was averaging 19.1 PPG on a 17-game stretch before his season ended.

 

There's no scrutiny placed on Perkins' inability to do these things because he's a limited player that's only good in a limited role. To me, Bynum's impact is easily more irreplaceable.

 

How is Bynum more versatile on defense? And he is not a better rebounder than Perkins who was pulling down nearly 12 a game in the playoffs as Boston's top rebounder. Boston was the best rebounding team in the league and Perkins was a big part of that. Without KG you see how his RPG numbers inflated in the playoffs.

 

And once again it looks like your another one of those guys that jerks off to Bynum's 2-3 weeks of solid production. His stats in that span are inflated as well because of that 42 point, 15 rebound game against the CLIPPERS loool. No other game comes close to that offensive production he had that game. There was only one other game during the entire season in which he had at least 25 points and it was against the Timberwolves in a fast paced 133-119 game where no defense was played and stats were inflated. And Perkins had as many 25+ point games during the season as Bynum did lool. Perkins is just in general a more dependable player who is more durable and more consistant.

[Big Penny]

Because Jameer Nelson was playing all-star basketball for the entire season up until it ended. Bynum was only playing all-star basketball for a period of 2 weeks or so and that's the only time in his career he's shown that flash. I'd like to see him do it for a longer period of time.

 

Plus Bynum was available for the entire playoffs and was starting while Nelson obviously rushed back too soon to play a back-up role for the NBA Finals.

 

I could tell your team rep without even looking at it.

and i can tell your a hater.

 

im not saying that drew is a better player than Jameer. dont think im saying that. Bynum's been playing decent ball for longer than 2 weeks. in all the games he played in the 2007-08 season he averaged 13/10. this season he put up 14/8. its not his fault he got injured, and hopefully (fingers crossed) he wont be injured for this season

 

drew rushed back for the playoffs. he shouldnt've been playing through all of it. but he helped his team out quite a bit. not as much as he couldve done if he was healthy, but he helped out a little. he did an OK job containing dwight (although 80% was pau's work). drew was essentially a backup anyway. he averaged 29 minutes during the reg. season, and only 17 during the post season.

[His Greatness]

I could tell your team rep without even looking at it.

Did his name give it away?

 

How is Bynum more versatile on defense? And he is not a better rebounder than Perkins who was pulling down nearly 12 a game in the playoffs as Boston's top rebounder. Boston was the best rebounding team in the league and Perkins was a big part of that. Without KG you see how his RPG numbers inflated in the playoffs.

He's more versatile because he's longer and more agile. I'll trust Bynum to recover quicker, be on top of rotations, and I'd be more comfortable with him defending the perimeter on switches or against any bigs with a face-up game. He's a disruptive defender by just being there because of his massive frame. Of course Perkins is a better overall defender because Bynum's defensive intellect hasn't caught up with his physical capabilities. And well, defense is Perkins' only priority.

 

On the glass, give me Bynum. He doesn't exactly have sound rebounding technique... but he's [expletive]ing huge, he's fast and he can jump high. Terse, but yeah.

 

And actually, LA was the best rebounding team in the league.

 

And once again it looks like your another one of those guys that jerks off to Bynum's 2-3 weeks of solid production. His stats in that span are inflated as well because of that 42 point, 15 rebound game against the CLIPPERS loool. No other game comes close to that offensive production he had that game. There was only one other game during the entire season in which he had at least 25 points and it was against the Timberwolves in a fast paced 133-119 game where no defense was played and stats were inflated. And Perkins had as many 25+ point games during the season as Bynum did lool. Perkins is just in general a more dependable player who is more durable and more consistant.

Why are 25-point games the cutoff? Why not 20 points? Why not just look at their averages?

 

Besides, it's not the statistics in that brief period that's important, it's what he showed he was capable of.

Edited August 28, 2009 by His Greatness

[Cleveland's Finest]

Because it pisses me off that all of the sudden he becomes a top 5 center now that he plays for LeBron's team.

 

All of the sudden?

 

Shaq ranked 3rd in ppg last year of all Centers, and he was more than 5 ppg above the next best ranked,

 

Shaq was 5th of all centers in rpg last year.

 

Shaq was number one in field goal pct.. Yes, above Dwight Howard even.

 

Shaq was also 6th in blocks per game last year of all center.

 

And it's all of the sudden?

 

And that's on a team that had over 20 less wins than the Cavs last year....think he'll be a little more motivated?

Edited August 28, 2009 by Cleveland's Finest

[Diesel]

Did his name give it away?

 

 

He's more versatile because he's longer and more agile. I'll trust Bynum to recover quicker, be on top of rotations, and I'd be more comfortable with him defending the perimeter on switches or against any bigs with a face-up game. He's a disruptive defender by just being there because of his massive frame. Of course Perkins is a better overall defender because Bynum's defensive intellect hasn't caught up with his physical capabilities. And well, defense is Perkins' only priority.

 

On the glass, give me Bynum. He doesn't exactly have sound rebounding technique... but he's [expletive]ing huge, he's fast and he can jump high. Terse, but yeah.

 

And actually, LA was the best rebounding team in the league.

 

 

Why are 25-point games the cutoff? Why not 20 points? Why not just look at their averages?

 

Besides, it's not the statistics in that brief period that's important, it's what he showed he was capable of.

 

I would rather have Perkins in those situations you listed. Perkins isn't a giant sniff so stop making Bynum look like a gazelle compared to him. I would rather have Perkins over Bynum in all of those circumstances you listed other than switching to guys on the perimeter, but when comparing the defense of 7 foot centers that is a very small detail. Bynum is two inches and 5 pounds more than Perkins and I guarantee you he's not nearly as strong. His "massive frame" isn't an advantage either.

 

Boston was the best rebounding team in the league. They outrebounded their oppenents by an average of 4.53 rebounds per game. LA outrebounded their opponents by an average of 2.47 RPG. Margin of rebound is a better indicator than total rebounds as the pace of the game plays a big factor in total rebounds. Perkins got 18.7% of his teams defensive rebounds while in the game. Bynum got 17.9% of his teams defensive rebounds in the game. He got 10.7% of rebounds offensively while Bynum got 9.9% while in the game. Perkins is a slightly better rebounder. It's a fact.

 

I used 25 points because you were jizzing over Bynum's 42 point game and say how Perkins would never sniff anything like that and acting like Bynum does it all the time. Well he had a good day and it was against the Clippers. He had one other game over 25 points(a little more than half of what he scored) so that shows it was a very rare occurance. Nothing to grab your willy over. Jamal Crawford scored 50 points in a game before. I guess his capable of being a teams primary scoring option. After all he did show he was capable of it.

[Erick Blasco]

 

Perkins is sloppy on offense and is a robot in the pivot. Sure he can score in the post, but that's like saying Steve Nash can play defense — they'll do it sometimes, but don't hold your breath. And according to Draft Express, he turns the ball over on 1/3 of his offensive possessions. Offensively, it's not even worth comparing the two, whereas I feel their defenses are more comparable because Bynum is more versatile there and is a better rebounder (on offense too).

 

He was a dud in the playoffs because he had no knees.

 

22 points, 4 boards, 3 blocks against Utah

16 points, 7 boards against Denver

15 points, 11 boards, 4 blocks against San Antonio

42 points against the Clippers. They're a bad team, but Perkins will never sniff 42 points in his life.

18 points, 10 boards against Dallas

13 points, 13 boards against Denver

 

And he was averaging 19.1 PPG on a 17-game stretch before his season ended.

 

There's no scrutiny placed on Perkins' inability to do these things because he's a limited player that's only good in a limited role. To me, Bynum's impact is easily more irreplaceable.

 

Perkins is better than a robot in the pivot. Of course he won't get many chances when he's a fifth option because of his teammates, but he can score a lot better than Nash can defend. There's also the line on draft express about Perkins, all things considered, being perhaps the best interior defender in the game. Seeing as how that aspect of his game has already translated into one NBA championship, and is improving, I have a lot of trust in him on the court.

 

Those Bynum numbers aren't that impressive. On that 17 game stretch, most of it is comprised of his 42 points against the Clippers, and other good games against bad teams.

 

Look his numbers against the better teams during that streak. 15 pts, 11 REB, 4 BLK, against the Spurs in a win is good. Grabbing 1, 3, 3, and 6 rebounds in a stretch against the Rockets, Cavs, Magic, and Spurs is not. Going 2-7 against the Hornets and Tyson Chandler, 1-4 against Joel Pryzbilla, and 9 points 7 rebounds against Kendrick Perkins aren't very good. Plus, the day before his streak began, he had an epic 3 points, 1 rebound, 5 foul performance against the Magic.

 

If Bynum's role is to defend and rebound, he doesn't do a very good job of that. If it's to command double teams against good opponents, he doesn't really do a great job of that either. The Lakers have easily replaced him with Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom during his injured time, and carried him to a title despite his minimal production.

 

Perkins is an elite defensive player. That means something.

 

 

How is he a losing player? Is it his dominant scoring ability? You can knock him all day for his defense, but he excels so much at scoring that it transcends his vices, and that aspect alone should elevate him into the top five.

 

Why does Jefferson belong up there but Stoudemire doesn't? And are Jefferson, Shaq, Perkins and Bynum really more equipped to carry their teams to victory than Amar'e?

 

He has middling games and becomes turnover prone when quick power forwards can pressure him, for example, last year's contest where the Celtics held him to 0-7 and 4 turnovers. His game against Denver, he did almost nothing when Kenyon Martin pressured him at the high post in the second half. In his playoff contests with the Spurs, he'd score 30 points, while the players he'd defend (or fail to help defend) would score more than 30. Who cares if you can score if you give it all right back?

 

Okafor, Lopez, and Nene. Did you see Kaman play two years ago when he was healthy? If you can do that with Chandler, why not with him?

 

I'll take Bogut over Przybilla and Wallace. Przybilla doesn't do enough for me defensively, and Wallace is an up-and-down player who I'm convinced is more concerned with launching treys than doing other things more conducive to winning. At least Bogut will always give me a 100%, ten boards, and solid defense and offense.

 

Kaman missed over 20 games two seasons ago and has been injury prone. I remember that year, he had a good year. He gobbled up all the team's rebounds because Elton Brand was done for the season. And against teams with athletic front lines, he offered almost nothing. Phoenix, Detroit, Boston, the Lakers, they all held him in check without any problems. He's not a very good individual or help defender, and he's not as explosive as Nene is.

 

Wallace is one of the game's best help defenders. He's a dog on offense, but he's a nasty defensive player. What more does Pryzbilla have to do defensively besides be great?

 

Bogut does a lot of things respectably, but what is he really good at? He's mediocre. And what king od non-specialist big man averages only 3 free throw attempts a game?

 

Lee will control the glass, play without the ball, and always hustle. Likewise with Biedrins, who will also impact the game defensively. They're both a 1000x more athletic and mobile than Z. If Ilgauskas wasn't playing with such great defensive support, the sieve we saw against Orlando would become commonplace.

 

Hustling is great, but if you can't stop anybody with your hustle, what does it mean? Biedrins has almost no impact defensively (just take it at his chest and he's at a player's mercy), while Lee has exactly no impact defensively. Neither are scorers either. Ilgauskas is big and can swallow up post players, and is a smart help defender. Those are a few things he does defensively, and he can actually shoot and sometimes score in the post too.

[Guest VicNabb]

I will say it again.

 

As much as I hate Sammy Dalembert I think he is above a few on this list.