YugoRocketsFan Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 We're in a time where people dont have common sense, people can read truths and still not see them as facts, people have been stubborn for the longest time, its obvious the Kings-Lakers, Mavericks-Rockets, Suns-Spurs series were all fixed, stubborn people cant accept it, but its true whether you like it or not, but its the past, who cares about it, its over and done with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 Calm down the NBA is rigged, get over yourselves jeez; Why would this ref have anything to lie about his name has been stained. To think that only he was involved in corruption is quite naive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 Fixed both ways for Lakers-Kings 2002 is the point Yugo, two games each. Unless you want to be stubborn about picking which games to focus on while ignoring others. Intellectually dishonest to pick a single game in a series when refs decided the outcome in four of them. The larger point from Donaghy is one many have suspected for a long time, the NBA manipulates ref assignments to extend a series. This has been Cuban's point throughout and after he got hosed in 2006 he's right to do so. Ref assignments need to be transparent and they're not, it's the NBA black box. From Hue Hollins calling Bulls playoff games after they had three wins (could always count on Chicago losing with Hue) to Knick Bavetta to Bernie Fryer the league will play ref tendencies to get the outcome they want, longer series = higher ratings = more revenue = more profits. Stern has been shameless about this for nearly 20 years. What needs to come out of Donaghy's book is a call for complete transparency in ref playoff assignments. All assignments for all games with the if/then's all in advance. That and only that will take the card out of Stern's hand and restore at least some level of credibility to the league. It has to happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 You clearly must have not read the whole article because Tim said exactly what you just stated. He said the whole series was prolonged for ratings but inevitably there was no way that Sacramento was going to win gm 7. The reason why I believe Tim is because he was so sure of inside information on games, such as that series, that he bet on them and won big. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 Sacramento had every opportunity to win game 7 and only have themselves to blame. They lost the game on the ft line shooting 53% to LA's 81%. Lakers had 33 fta's Sac had 30, no one who watched that game can say the reffing was biased, it wasn't. The Kings shot themselves in the foot, it was theirs to win and they choked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 Fine Sky... If you believe that the ref's would manipulate the games up until game 7 and then grow a conscious to ref fairly is a bit hypocritical. Nonetheless this is Tim D we are reading from but I still want to read the book because I just have lost a lot of respect for the league. I can't tell you the last game I have watched respectively because there always seems to be a bias for one team; Even the greatest competitor can be outsmarted. I just read up on here for the latest news. The NBA is all about money. How does LBJ already have a movie deal and book deal and he has not even won a ring. All the league is a bunch of celebrities that sell shoes and jerseys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 The league manipulates to extend a series. They get to game 7 then it's mission accomplished. If you contend game 7 was a screw job to get LA in then I'd say prove it. Free throw margin only favored LA by 3 and fans of both teams at the time considered game 7 to be called evenly favoring neither side. The point remains that if Sac hit just 60% of their free throws they would have won the game. The league doesn't fix games to help LA, but to help the owners and (at that time) NBC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest N4S Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 ^ Why are you so defense on this? Because some of it involves LA? The league wants game 7's but the league also wants specific teams to advance to face another team that could bring better ratings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted October 29, 2009 Owner Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 ^ Why are you so defense on this? Because some of it involves LA? The league wants game 7's but the league also wants specific teams to advance to face another team that could bring better ratings.That explains why LeBron played against Kobe in the Finals last year, I guess...and why the Spurs (the most exciting team in the history of the game) have won four championships since 1999. Sort of explains why Dallas was the one to face the Heat instead of the super-slow, low-scoring Phoenix Suns, and that HAS to be why the Spurs swept LeBron and his Cavs in 2007...just four games was enough of LeBron. Makes sense to me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 ^ Why are you so defense on this? Because some of it involves LA? The league wants game 7's but the league also wants specific teams to advance to face another team that could bring better ratings. I'm defensive because I'm sick and tired of Laker haters perpetuating half truths. All the focus on Sac game 6 while ignoring game 2 and 5 which were both complete hose jobs against LA. Claiming game 7 had to be biased when the facts of the game and fans of both teams say otherwise. The bigger picture is money guys, on a macro scale. You keep trying to make it fit an agenda, but the true agenda is the pursuit of money. Extending a series, not about LA, about money for ownership and the networks. Gasol trade, not about LA, about saving Heisley $50 million when no one else offered him more than $20 million. If the league wanted specific teams in the finals then San Antonio would never have made a final. TV market is too small. San Antonio-New Jersey yeah that'll rake in the viewers and the cash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest N4S Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 Ok, I understand then most of your comments in this thread are defensive driven toward the Lakers. It's cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 And that defense is totally justified when you look at all of the facts, not just select ones to fit an agenda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YugoRocketsFan Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 That explains why LeBron played against Kobe in the Finals last year, I guess...and why the Spurs (the most exciting team in the history of the game) have won four championships since 1999. Sort of explains why Dallas was the one to face the Heat instead of the super-slow, low-scoring Phoenix Suns, and that HAS to be why the Spurs swept LeBron and his Cavs in 2007...just four games was enough of LeBron. Makes sense to me. If the series had been a lot closer and the Cavs didnt play like crap it would have been lebron vs kobe. I still dont get why are you being so defensive, the series was rigged(Kings). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Feelgood Posted October 29, 2009 Report Share Posted October 29, 2009 It's gonna be somewhat tough to watch the Blazer game tonight. Now I'm gonna be thinking that the refs are trying to rig the game or single a player out. Damn. I'm interested in this book now. Also, loving all the Lakers/Kings debate. Now while I can't stand the Lakers at all and you can add me to the list of Laker haters, Sky has made great points. Look at all the games, not just a select few. He provided good in depth posts about games that he thought were clearly rigged (I actually didn't watch this series because at the time, we only had one TV and it was being occupied by my mom the entire series). As much as I would love to disagree with him and call him out on it, he provided damn good points in that series. He looked at games that were rigged in favor of the Kings. Anyways, keep this going. It's very entertaining. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted October 30, 2009 Owner Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 the series was rigged(Kings).You, like the others, have no answer to what I said before, and what Sky is repeating. Nobody ever replied to it a year ago when we had this debate, and now that he's saying the same exact thing about two extra games (and going into more detail than I did), there are still people with their mouths shut. But that's how they should be in this situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Universe Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 That's why you can't take basketball too seriously because just like everything, it's entertainment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastNiner Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 No, those two games were not fixed, and I have watched the whole series this past year because there was a thread about that series that the Los Angeles Lakers fans were delusional in. The calls were sooooooooooooooooo bad in Game 6 that the amount of poor calls that entire playoffs couldn't equate to Game 6 alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teletopez Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 That explains why LeBron played against Kobe in the Finals last year, I guess...and why the Spurs (the most exciting team in the history of the game) have won four championships since 1999. Sort of explains why Dallas was the one to face the Heat instead of the super-slow, low-scoring Phoenix Suns, and that HAS to be why the Spurs swept LeBron and his Cavs in 2007...just four games was enough of LeBron. Makes sense to me.Well the whole NBA may not be trying to control outcomes, but that doesn't dismiss a few referees getting involved. You never know what games referees may have wished to tweak, and you also have to see who were the officials for what games. Maybe the Spurs never played in a game with officials x, y, and z. And assuming the NBA truly isn't trying to change game outcomes, they're probably investigating those tendencies, though I don't see them finding any officials as easily as Donaghy. Donaghy accused other officials of being biased, but then again, he may have been trying to save himself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenneral Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 UPDATE: This book has been cancelled by the publisher. http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4603209 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poe Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 "Somehow, the NBA got wind of the project and let Random House know in a threatening-type correspondence that they would object to the publication of such a book and they threatened that they would sue if they did go ahead and do that," said Berdan, who didn't see any letters from the NBA. "Random House considered that and ... just pulled the plug on it." "The NBA never threatened a lawsuit or anything else," NBA vice president of basketball communications Tim Frank wrote in an e-mail to ESPN.com. Hmmm.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 No, those two games were not fixed, and I have watched the whole series this past year because there was a thread about that series that the Los Angeles Lakers fans were delusional in. The calls were sooooooooooooooooo bad in Game 6 that the amount of poor calls that entire playoffs couldn't equate to Game 6 alone. Fine game 2 and 5 weren't fixed they were just blown. Label it however you want. A horrible ref call decided game 5. Unless you believe Webber is slapping his palm on the floor in frustration for no apparent reason and Webber hitting the ball OB was just a magic trick and didn't really happen. Why do you think game 6 happened? The league reviewed the tapes on 5 and knew they literally handed the game to Sacramento on a completely blown call. The travesty of 5 created the even worse travesty of 6. Then you have game 2 where according to you in a highly rated series where LA won the first game on the road and can end the series with a win, in a game where Kobe is out and the Lakers must rely on Shaq it's mere coincidence that the league assigned known Shaq hater Bernie Fryer to the game. And it's just coincidence that he called two offensive fouls on Shaq in the first half and O'Neal sits and is in foul trouble all game long. And the series is back at 1-1 which by coincidence happens to serve the purposes of the league and NBC in a season where the tv contracts are up for renewal. Yeah ok. Six was horrendous. But what's the result? The refs hand a win to LA. What was the result of game two? The refs hand a win to Sac. Game 5? Refs hand a win to Sac. You can claim two and five weren't rigged and that six was worse but the end result is the same. Horrendous reffing and highly suspicious ref assignments led to wins. Game 6 LA. Game 2 and 5 Sacramento. Add the Samaki prayer answered 3 that shouldn't have counted before halftime in game four and you get this: Ref created wins for LA 2, ref created wins for Sacramento 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenneral Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 Hmmm..I bet the NBA did threaten them in some sort. There's no other reason that this book would be pulled as it would certainly be a hit among all basketball fans dying for the truth. My guess would be that he'll just find a new publisher and that he will get his story out - no matter what it takes. He has nothing to lose now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poe Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 I bet the NBA did threaten them in some sort. There's no other reason that this book would be pulled as it would certainly be a hit among all basketball fans dying for the truth. My guess would be that he'll just find a new publisher and that he will get his story out - no matter what it takes. He has nothing to lose now.Yea, this time there can't be any internet leaks. The fact that the NBA is accused of threatening the publishing company actually makes Donaughy's case stronger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 (edited) The 2002 Western Conference Finals between the Los Angeles Lakers and the Sacramento Kings presents a stunning example of game and series manipulation at its ugliest. As the teams prepared for Game 6 at the Staples Center, Sacramento had a 3–2 lead in the series. The referees assigned to work Game 6 were Dick Bavetta, Bob Delaney, and Ted Bernhardt. As soon as the referees for the game were chosen, the rest of us knew immediately that there would be a Game 7. A prolonged series was good for the league, good for the networks, and good for the game. In the pregame meeting prior to Game 6, the league office sent down word that certain calls — calls that would have benefitted the Lakers — were being missed by the referees. This was the type of not-so-subtle information that I and other referees were left to interpret. After receiving the dispatch, Bavetta openly talked about the fact that the league wanted a Game 7. "If we give the benefit of the calls to the team that's down in the series, nobody's going to complain. The series will be even at three apiece, and then the better team can win Game 7," Bavetta stated. As history shows, Sacramento lost Game 6 in a wild come-from-behind thriller that saw the Lakers repeatedly sent to the foul line by the referees. For other NBA referees watching the game on television, it was a shameful performance by Bavetta's crew, one of the most poorly officiated games of all time. Just read that quote please; Tim Donaghy is saying exactly what the Laker's fans have been saying the whole time. Though my point still remains that two wrongs do not make a right and that the league can not be held credible because of things like this. Edited October 30, 2009 by Ya Dig! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted October 30, 2009 Owner Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 Just read that quote please; Tim Donaghy is saying exactly what the Laker's fans have been saying the whole time. Though my point still remains that two wrongs do not make a right and that the league can not be held credible because of things like this.As I stated in my first post, one read line and people seem to mold their conclusions from it. It's not difficult to read the entire article. Thanks for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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