Cleveland's Finest Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 http://www.nba.com/statistics/plusminus/plusminus_sort.jsp?pcomb=1&season=22009&split=9&team= He leads the league in +/-. Think about that. That means when he's on the court, that's when a team is playing at it's best collectively essentially. Look at all the other names on that list. Artest, Dirk, LeBron, and he's on top. Averaging 8.2 ppg and 8 rpg including a steal and a block. He does everything on the floor. He isn't the strongest guy. Rather, he uses his position on the court in relation to who he's guarding or where he's trying to rebound from to his advantage. That's what makes him such a hard and smart working player. Also, he shoots 52.6 %. That efficiency rating shows why he makes such an impact on the court. He hustles so hard and it's awesome seeing him find ways to get to the basket to catch LeBron's passes for the easy layup/dunk. Why is he better than the other candidates? Jason Terry, Al Harrington (some other 6th men candidates), aren't even in the top 50 of efficiency. Even if you guys don't think he should win, at least this shows he should be in the discussion. He plays a part in all of the Cavaliers wins with key rebounds and points that are barely recognized. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Penny Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 he should definately be a candidae... but if i had to pick the award i would give it to jamaal crawford lamar odom could be a candidate if he stopped shooting 42% <_< Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastNiner Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 http://www.nba.com/statistics/plusminus/plusminus_sort.jsp?pcomb=1&season=22009&split=9&team= He leads the league in +/-. Think about that. That means when he's on the court, that's when a team is playing at it's best collectively essentially. Look at all the other names on that list. Artest, Dirk, LeBron, and he's on top. Averaging 8.2 ppg and 8 rpg including a steal and a block. He does everything on the floor. He isn't the strongest guy. Rather, he uses his position on the court in relation to who he's guarding or where he's trying to rebound from to his advantage. That's what makes him such a hard and smart working player. Also, he shoots 52.6 %. That efficiency rating shows why he makes such an impact on the court. He hustles so hard and it's awesome seeing him find ways to get to the basket to catch LeBron's passes for the easy layup/dunk. Why is he better than the other candidates? Jason Terry, Al Harrington (some other 6th men candidates), aren't even in the top 50 of efficiency. Even if you guys don't think he should win, at least this shows he should be in the discussion. He plays a part in all of the Cavaliers wins with key rebounds and points that are barely recognized. You lost all credibility once you brought up +/- in the NBA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erick Blasco Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 You lost all credibility once you brought up +/- in the NBA. No he didn't, it's a telling indicator of Varejao's value. It's still very early to make anything concrete, but Vareajo's main competition is Carl Landry who is playing out of his mind, plus Crawford and Terry who can fill a scoreboard. Also, the four players are playing for good teams. Odom, Manu Ginobili, and J.R. Smith haven't been up to their usual heroics, Luke Ridnour doesn't have enough of an impact, Harrington is hit or miss on an awful team. I'd put Landry first, Varejao second, and Crawford beats out Terry for third. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted January 3, 2010 Owner Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 More +/- stats? Really? As I've said before, the +/- stats take more into account than just the single player's impact on the floor. They actually factor in the other four playing on the floor with him at the same time. If you need a great example of this...take the Houston Rockets. With Shane Battier off the court, Houston is a +6. With Trevor Ariza off the court, they are a +6.3. With Luis Scola off the court, they are a +4.6. With Aaron Brooks off the court, they are a +4.6. Those players on the court? Houston is at or under a +0 for each of them. So....seriously? Is Houston really better off without Scola, Ariza, Battier AND Brooks? I'm pretty sure the stat makes little to no sense when discussing individual player impact. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Feelgood Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 I'd say Carl Landry should be 6th man of the year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poe Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 I think Landry will be the most likely to get it. Though I think Haslem's impact on the court is underrated, it will always remain that way unless in the future he's given a larger role on another team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingfish Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 The other day Fisher was like a +7 and Kobe was +1............LOL. Bench Kobe, play more Fisher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueDevil Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 no. Varejao will not get this award. my pick is Crawford or Landry. not Varejao not a chance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Check my Stats Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 (edited) Should be Crawford, don't even mention Andy in this award please. He is NOT a game changer like guys like Manu, Crawford, Terry etc. Edited January 3, 2010 by travesy3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChosenOne Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 No he didn't, it's a telling indicator of Varejao's value. It's still very early to make anything concrete, but Vareajo's main competition is Carl Landry who is playing out of his mind, plus Crawford and Terry who can fill a scoreboard. Also, the four players are playing for good teams. Odom, Manu Ginobili, and J.R. Smith haven't been up to their usual heroics, Luke Ridnour doesn't have enough of an impact, Harrington is hit or miss on an awful team. I'd put Landry first, Varejao second, and Crawford beats out Terry for third. He definately gets it right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erick Blasco Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 More +/- stats? Really? As I've said before, the +/- stats take more into account than just the single player's impact on the floor. They actually factor in the other four playing on the floor with him at the same time. If you need a great example of this...take the Houston Rockets. With Shane Battier off the court, Houston is a +6. With Trevor Ariza off the court, they are a +6.3. With Luis Scola off the court, they are a +4.6. With Aaron Brooks off the court, they are a +4.6. Those players on the court? Houston is at or under a +0 for each of them. So....seriously? Is Houston really better off without Scola, Ariza, Battier AND Brooks? I'm pretty sure the stat makes little to no sense when discussing individual player impact. Actually it does, Battier hasn't been first class defensively, Ariza's struggled, and Houston's starting lineup hasn't exactly dazzled. The Rockets just decimate people when Landry and Lowry come in off the bench. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warren2ThaG Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 More like flopper/girl of tha year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erick Blasco Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 Should be Crawford, don't even mention Andy in this award please. He is NOT a game changer like guys like Manu, Crawford, Terry etc. He sure changed the Lakers game around with his defense. And he sure changed the way Atlanta tried to score under the hoop. Plus that three pointer against the Hawks to seal the second win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erick Blasco Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 (edited) The other day Fisher was like a +7 and Kobe was +1............LOL. Bench Kobe, play more Fisher. Huh? Kobe has a net +/- of +19.9 this year. It has to be top ten in the league. Edit: Third in the league behind Dirk, Artest, and if you want to count his somewhat small sample size, Rip Hamilton. Edited January 4, 2010 by Erick Blasco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest California Dreamin' Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 Carl Landry should win the award this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWaLL Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 1. Carl Landry2. Jamal Crawford3. Jason Terry4. Manu Ginobili5. Ben Gordon6. Lamar Odom I haven't even gotten to Varejao yet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleveland's Finest Posted January 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 Lol at Odom and even Gordon....are you going by 2k ratings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWaLL Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 Lol at Odom and even Gordon....are you going by 2k ratings?Huh? Anyway, I'd definitely rank them over Varejao. Not saying Varejao isn't a great contributer off the bench, but he definitely won't be the sixth man of the year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleveland's Finest Posted January 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 I just didn't get where you got Gordon from...I mean he's not affecting games like he did in Chicago. Just because he scores 18 ppg, he still isn't making key shots and certainly hasn't helped them win much at all. And I see Odom as more of a contributor and I don't see him work as hard as Andy and he isn't as key in big games. How was he vs. Cleveland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingfish Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 Huh? Kobe has a net +/- of +19.9 this year. It has to be top ten in the league. Edit: Third in the league behind Dirk, Artest, and if you want to count his somewhat small sample size, Rip Hamilton.The other day against the Kings Fish was +7 and Kobe was only +1. I was saying we should bench Kobe and play more Fish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sun Tzu Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 I would have chosen Crawford as my lock for Sixth Man if the Hawks kept it up but they are getting worse and worse as the season progresses and he has finally been knocked back down with the other sixth men in the league. I'd say the guys who are up there are Crawford, Terry, Landry and maybe Varejao. But if Varejao does keep it up then maybe he might get a chance to be a Sixth man candidate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted January 4, 2010 Owner Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 Actually it does, Battier hasn't been first class defensively, Ariza's struggled, and Houston's starting lineup hasn't exactly dazzled. The Rockets just decimate people when Landry and Lowry come in off the bench.I guess I can give better examples. Fisher on the court, the Lakers are a +12.5. Fisher off? They are a +1.4. Gasol on? +14.8. Off it? They are +1.6. It's pretty difficult for me to believe that Gasol and Fisher have nearly the same impact on and off the floor, especially when everyone knows Fisher is a pathetic defensive player and a terrible offensive player, shooting 37% from the floor with just seven points a game. By the way, LeBron James was a -2 tonight against the Bobcats, despite drilling them for 29/7/6 on 62% shooting, just one turnover...while Anthony Parker's 40% shooting, 5/2/2 and PATHETIC defense on Stephen Jackson still gave him a +2 in the +/- column. Worst stat you could ever use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastCoastNiner Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 I guess I can give better examples. Fisher on the court, the Lakers are a +12.5. Fisher off? They are a +1.4. Gasol on? +14.8. Off it? They are +1.6. It's pretty difficult for me to believe that Gasol and Fisher have nearly the same impact on and off the floor, especially when everyone knows Fisher is a pathetic defensive player and a terrible offensive player, shooting 37% from the floor with just seven points a game. By the way, LeBron James was a -2 tonight against the Bobcats, despite drilling them for 29/7/6 on 62% shooting, just one turnover...while Anthony Parker's 40% shooting, 5/2/2 and PATHETIC defense on Stephen Jackson still gave him a +2 in the +/- column. Worst stat you could ever use. It's only a good stat for hockey, but in the NBA, with all of the fouling at the end, and having to deal with bench players being put in the game during a blowout, and then having them suck can really hurt a player's +/-. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owner Real Deal Posted January 4, 2010 Owner Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 Yeah. There are a lot of times where Gasol or Kobe will play with Vujacic, Farmar, Mbenga and Powell/Walton in the five, and that unit will struggle, thus hurting Kobe and Gasol's +/- stats, despite what they do in that span of 3-4 minutes where Phil Jackson declines to call a timeout, and lets Vujacic launch three bricks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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