Miami Intensifies Pursuit of Stoudemire

[Flash]

Wade is a good defender when he wants to be.

 

Meh. He's easily the best help defender amongst guards in the NBA but his 1 on 1 defense is so-so. Giving up all of our 3's minus Jones is a risky move IMO.

 

That trade would put us under the luxury tax though which Is why I think it might get done.

[SRV]

If this went through, I think our lineup would be something like this.

 

PG - Alston

SG - Wade

SF - Beasley

PF - Amare/Haslem/O'Neal

C- Amare/O'Neal

 

Bench: Arroyo, Jones, Anthony, Magloire, O'Neal/Haslem..and I don't even know who else is on our team. That is assuming we trade Chalmers, Q ,Wright, and Cook.

 

Basically we would have to sign some guys to get a bench at least, we would have to many big men and not enough guards and SF's.

Edited February 17, 2010 by SRV

[Real Deal]

Alright, following this crap for so long, here's what I have...

 

1) The Suns want Beasley. Miami won't trade him. Not a chance, they say...

 

2) The Heat are wanting to deal Jermaine O'Neal. The Suns don't want him. They want young talent and picks.

 

3) Phoenix loves Wright and Chalmers...gives them youth to replace both Hill and Nash soon. Cook is a three-point specialist that fits their system (we know how PHX likes to stock up on three-point shooters). Richardson doesn't really mean anything to the Suns except for being a filler (better than taking Jermaine and no young players).

 

4) The picks Phoenix wants only makes things better for the Suns, because they feel Wade may not return, and suddenly, those picks become really good ones. If Amare doesn't stay, and Wade doesn't stay...the Heat could become one of the worst teams in the NBA...Suns' thought process kicks in, and those picks become very tasty in a trade for their expiring player.

 

5) The Heat aren't set on trading their entire roster for Amare, but having Wade, Beasley and STAT on the same team for 2-3 months seems like a great plan to keep Dwyane and Amare in Miami for contract extensions. Promising futures always have a major impact on what a franchise player does during free agency.

 

I'm really not sure how the trade will go down, though. Phoenix is pulling in offers from the Cavaliers and the Sixers. Philadelphia has told them they won't deal Iguodala for Stoudemire unless the deal includes Dalembert (on their end) and Barbosa (on the Suns' side). The Suns don't want Dalembert or Elton Brand...yet, without them, a trade is tough to work out for Amare, so the likelihood that Amare ends up in Philly is very small.

 

Philly actually came out and said Iggy isn't even on the block, but we all know that's not exactly true.

 

Cavaliers and Heat...they are the front-runners. The Heat can't make up their mind and they refuse to deal Beasley, while the Cavaliers have already given the Suns their offer (which now may include Jamario Moon).

 

It's gonna be a tough two days for Miami.

[Poe]

If this went through, I think our lineup would be something like this.

 

PG - Alston

SG - Wade

SF - Beasley

PF - Amare/Haslem/O'Neal

C- Amare/O'Neal

 

Bench: Arroyo, Jones, Anthony, Magloire, O'Neal/Haslem..and I don't even know who else is on our team. That is assuming we trade Chalmers, Q ,Wright, and Cook.

 

Basically we would have to sign some guys to get a bench at least, we would have to many big men and not enough guards and SF's.

 

Position depth with that deal would be:

 

PG: Alston/Arroyo

SG: Wade/???

SF: Jones/Diawara

PF: Amar'e/Beasley/Haslem

C: O'Neal/Anthony/Magloire

 

 

That's not comparing starting line up and bench, that's just the depth chart for each player and their natural position. If this deal were to go down, the Heat would have 11 players left, so one more player would need to go the Heat's way, and it obviously needs to be a shooting guard.

 

The depth at the PG, SG, AND SF get a heck of a lot worse with this deal. Sure, an Alston - Wade - Beasley - Amare - O'Neal starting line up looks killer on paper, but the bench would be disastrous, and Spoelstra already has a bad reputation among Heat fans with his in-game rotations.

 

Not to mention, the Heat bench have been outstanding the past 3 games, averaging out about 44 points per game during that stretch, and even outscoring the starters in some occasions.

 

The defense has been superb as well, holding all three of these teams to under 80 points, which includes playoff teams in the Hawks and the Rockets. If that deal were to go down, the perimeter defense would take a big hit with Beasley starting trying to guard SFs full time, Jones being outmatched trying to defend SGs off the bench due to lack of depth on the perimeter, and Amare already have a bad reputation on his defensive effort.

 

 

[expletive], I hope that deal doesn't go down. Not just because it would create so many problems, but I've grown an attachment to many of these players. It sucks to see one or two go, but four key rotation guys?? It's one thing to trade for Shaq, but Amare isn't even near the same level of impact as Shaq was at the time. Common, Riles.

[Cleveland's Finest]

Chalmers, Cook, Richardson, AND Wright? That's way too many players for me to handle. Common, Riley, don't do this...

 

Suns have 2 roster spots open...

[Poe]

It's gonna be a tough two days for Miami.

Tell me about it. I'm nervous as it is. I don't want to see certain players go, but at the same time, I understand the business, the necessity to bring the right talent to surround Wade, and build a potential dynasty.

[Poe]

Suns have 2 roster spots open...

That's not what I was referring to.

 

What I'm saying is, I hate to see players go. One or two guys is hard enough, but 4 key guys is a bit much for me.

 

- As badly as Chalmers has done this season, I can't help but like the guy, and hope he's able to turn it around. I'm rooting for him to regain that defensive intensity he had last season, combine that with his offensive improvement, and build his way back into the starting line up.

 

- Cook is another young guy I'm rooting for. I loved the range he brought last season, and his perimeter defense is actually pretty good. It was a great memory to see him win the 3 point shootout to represent the Heat team.

 

- Wright has become one of my favorite players, not just on the Heat team itself, but in the whole league. I truly believe he's going to become one of the top players in the league and he'll have at least one or two all star games in by his prime. I mean it.

 

- Quentin is newer, so I wouldn't be too dissapointed to see him go. He had great motivation to start the season. He showed so much dedication to lose that weight, buying into the Heat system by leading the team in drawn charges, and seeing his reaction to hitting key 3 point shots made me think he was one of my favorite guys. That motivation hasn't lasted, though, and the grueling 82 game season has gotten to him early. The strong play to start the season turned out to be a spurt that was short lived, unfortunately.

[Check my Stats]

I think if you are trading 4 'depth' guys for a star, quite simply, you do it, no questions asked.

 

Anyways I think value-wise this would be a great deal for Miami, especially since it is Amare's home town and he will likely re-sign. I think the Heat would need to make another move or two after this to acquire a shooter, since they will have NONE, and IMO you can't have a team without at least one good/great outside shooter starting or at least on the bench. They could probably pick up a cheap outside shooter on a half decent contract.

 

I also think you are crazy on Dorell Wright, he is decent but will be a 5th starter at best IMO.

 

JO | Amare | Beasley | Wade | Alston

 

That is a pretty damn talented starting 5, and it would pretty much ensure Wade would stay.

[Real Deal]

Yeah, we've talked about this before...I just don't see an all-star in Dorell. He's had six years in the league now, one season where he averaged 25 minutes per game, and the only thing that stood out for me was his rebounding and his shooting percentage, but that was expected given the shots he took.

 

In those first five seasons, he only had one where he played over 45 games...and that was the season prior to the one I mentioned above, and he played 66 games.

 

If he put on more weight, he would be a better defender. Shot-blocking and playing the passing lanes are due to his athleticism, but someone can take him into the post and abuse him, and there have been players blowing past him as well. He doesn't make the best decisions with the basketball, either, which is why he's best in transition or getting most of his shots assisted by teammates.

 

Typically, all-stars have a lot more in their repertoire, especially by their sixth season in the NBA. Dorell hasn't shown to be a legit sixth man in the NBA, let alone at a starter level. The more the Heat wait, the longer they stay in the middle of the pack in the conference, and they'll find less and less teams interested in Wright.

[Clutch]

dorell isnt an all-star but he is a very good role player (much like shannon brown for the lakers)

 

lets not forget he had been dealing with injuries the past few years

[SRV]

Our starting line up would be great though, you gotta admit. We would probably have one of the top offenses, and we could run the fast break much more than we do. Our defense won't be great, but if we can put up a lot of points and play defense here and there, we could be a good team. I don't expect our defense to be great, but if it can allow from 90-95 ppg we should be good with an offense that could probably put up 100. It would certainly be a more entertaining game to watch than running a half court offense and walking the ball up the court all the time.

Edited February 17, 2010 by SRV

[Clutch]

i think spo has had the team playing pretty well defensively as of late - we might not be that bad on the defensive end even with the trade

[Flash]

This deal is worthless to me if we give up both first rounders. We need young guys here who can play!

[Flash]

FWIW I hear we're interested in Roger Mason Jr. I'd definitely welcome a guy with his shooting ability if we do in fact make this Amare deal.

[SRV]

Looks like Amare is all but ours, Cleveland already got Jamison. His only choice now is to stay with the Suns.

 

BTW, we were interested in Roger Mason, but we backed off because of his contract or something.

Edited February 18, 2010 by SRV

[Check my Stats]

Mason would be a good compliment to Wade.

[SRV]

Actually, I just heard that we aren't offering Beasley or any picks. The Suns feel we aren't taking them seriously.

[KurbyFX]

What exactly is the Heat offering?

[SRV]

I am guessing Wright, Chalmers, Cook, QRich. We aren't offering picks according to RealGM.

[KurbyFX]

What a pathetic offer. Guess the Suns looking for players who can start chucking some points to make games close.

[Poe]

I think if you are trading 4 'depth' guys for a star, quite simply, you do it, no questions asked.

I never denied the talent, and I understand the reasons behind the move. I just don't like seeing players leave. That's all I was saying.

 

 

Yeah, we've talked about this before...I just don't see an all-star in Dorell. He's had six years in the league now, one season where he averaged 25 minutes per game, and the only thing that stood out for me was his rebounding and his shooting percentage, but that was expected given the shots he took.

 

In those first five seasons, he only had one where he played over 45 games...and that was the season prior to the one I mentioned above, and he played 66 games.

 

If he put on more weight, he would be a better defender. Shot-blocking and playing the passing lanes are due to his athleticism, but someone can take him into the post and abuse him, and there have been players blowing past him as well. He doesn't make the best decisions with the basketball, either, which is why he's best in transition or getting most of his shots assisted by teammates.

 

Typically, all-stars have a lot more in their repertoire, especially by their sixth season in the NBA. Dorell hasn't shown to be a legit sixth man in the NBA, let alone at a starter level. The more the Heat wait, the longer they stay in the middle of the pack in the conference, and they'll find less and less teams interested in Wright.

"He's had six years in the league now, one season where he averaged 25 minutes per game"

 

- Forget the 6 year timeframe. This guy has had less games played than most third year players, and most of the playing time he had in his own first three years were during garbage time. Why was that? Because he was playing behind Posey and Walker while the Heat were busy going after a championship. When Dorell finally had a chance to play, he had an injury that sat him out for a year and a half, plus other injuries earlier in his career that kept him on the bench without ever getting consistent playing time.

 

 

"He doesn't make the best decisions with the basketball"

 

- I completely disagree. Dorell makes very good decisions with the basketball. He is typically relied on to be a point-forward in the offense. He reads the defense well, keeps his head up, and has a point guard's mentality of knowing where every player is on the floor at all times. He averages just barely 1 turnover per 36 minutes despite handling the ball as much as he does. Over the past three games, he's averaged 4 assists as a result of Spoelstra giving him a larger role off the bench. Though it was in just a 24 minute average, he didn't play any end-game minutes since all those games happened to be blowouts, when he normally plays crunch time with Wade and Richardson.

 

 

"Typically, all-stars have a lot more in their repertoire"

 

- I think Dorell has a heck of a lot in his repertoire. I'm not basing his all star potential on blind faith, here. He has everything in his skill-set needed to become one. The only things that has stood in his way are confidence and experience. Now that he's getting consistent minutes, his confidence is growing, and so is his experience on the court.

 

What Dorell has in his repertoire:

 

- Unique ability to both play and defend up to 4 positions.

- Ball handles very well for a player his size, giving him the ability to run the point-forward.

- Has a point guards mentality on offense, and can be relied on to make the right read with the ball in his hands in many situations like pick and rolls, the fast break, and simply driving to the basket.

- Shoots a high percentage from all areas on the floor, including the recent addition of a consistent 3 point shot.

- Has the athleticism to finish well around the basket, block shots defensively, and grab rebounds consistently.

- Feeds well off of play makers, and is becoming better at timing his cuts to the basket and finding the open area on the court.

- Will read plays defensively, and with his athleticism and length, will grab steals, get deflections, and bother jumpshooters.

- Guards the post well despite his thin frame.

 

 

What Dorell lacks:

 

- Better strength

- An offensive post game

- Supreme confidence

 

 

To me, that's an all star potential repertoire. Strength is something he can control, though I don't believe it's an extreme problem of any sorts. Confidence is probably his biggest key, and as that grows, so does his game.

 

Other than that, he shoots well, finishes well, passes well, rebounds well, blocks shots, gets steals, and doesn't turn the ball over very much. With the all-around numbers that he'll put up by his prime, he should become an all star.

 

As he gets consistent playing time, he's proven to get better and better each game. He's shown a lot of growth this season, and still has a lot more growing room left. I just hope Pat Riley realizes that.

[HornyWetPenguin]

This move is needed to keep Wade. Out of Bosh, LBJ, and Wade, I think Wade is the one that will most likely leave.

[Legacy]

Now that Jamison is with the Cavs, does this mean that Amar'e will be traded to Miami?

[Check my Stats]

I think it means Amare will be staying in Phoenix.

[SRV]

This move is needed to keep Wade. Out of Bosh, LBJ, and Wade, I think Wade is the one that will most likely leave.

Why would Wade be more likely to leave? He has this over Bosh and LBJ.

- He won a championship here

- He loves the city of Miami as does every other player in the NBA

- We can sign any FA we want if we pursue them hard enough

- We have loads of cap room

- He has said a thousand times he wants to play here

- Not once have I heard Lebron or Bosh say they want to stay where they are, nor have they won a championship, and who would want to play in Cleveland or Canada if the stars aren't there?